Rats as big as cats in Southampton, pest controllers warn

Daily Echo: Rats as big as cats spotted in Southampton Rats as big as cats spotted in Southampton

SUPER-sized rats have been spotted on the streets of Southampton, according to the city’s pest controllers.

Rats have been gorging on takeaway leftovers and rubbish spilling out of bins, and as a result growing to the size of cats.

It is thought the recent flooding has forced the rodents into more urban areas where they have been feasting on scraps they are finding in the streets.

Now Southampton pest controller Sean Whelan has warned traditional methods of exterminating them are not as effective due to their sheer bulk.

Mr Whelan, who runs the Netley-based Whelan Pest Prevention, said: “They are as big as a small cat.

“We do see big rats in Southampton and they are certainly getting bigger.

“There are a number of houses in town that used to be three or four-bedroom homes. But now they are student properties instead of families living in a big property.

“It means you have four individuals living in one house, so that’s four bins, and it means you get bags falling on to the street and food falling on to the pavement.

“The more they eat, the bigger they will get.”

He added that he believed twice weekly bin collections in some areas were also to blame.

Recently he caught a super-rat on the streets of Liverpool, where he also runs a pest control business, and claims his firm has seen an overall 15 per cent increase in rat infestation call-outs over the past year.

Mr Whelan said super-rats are common in agricultural areas but the wet weather at the beginning of the year may have forced the rodents into the city.

He previously warned the mutant super-rats in Hampshire are immune to regular poison after a survey among councils revealed the number of rats infesting Hampshire has rocketed in recent years.

Giant rats spreading into cities was predicted by Professor Robert Smith, a scientist at the University of Huddersfield, who found that rats in Hampshire had a mutant gene that helps them develop a resistance to poison.

He said it was only a matter of time before super-rats marched into our cities and invaded neighbouring counties.

Mr Whelan said it could become necessary to petition the European Union and the government allowing pest controllers to use stronger bait.

“I have been doing this job for 23 years and I still jump when I see one. Just because they are bigger doesn’t mean it’s going to attack you.

“We have always had rats – they are not killer rats but if you see one take a note of where you saw it and report it to your local authority or pest control company.”

Councillor Jacqui Rayment, Southampton City Council’s Cabinet member for environment and transport, declined to comment.

Comments (39)

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8:08am Tue 15 Apr 14

Bobs Your Uncle ? says...

Fleas the size of rats sucked on rats the size of cats ,come to think of it ,Southampton is becoming hunger city.
Fleas the size of rats sucked on rats the size of cats ,come to think of it ,Southampton is becoming hunger city. Bobs Your Uncle ?
  • Score: -7

8:19am Tue 15 Apr 14

CHARLIE TAYLOR says...

Has this been proved ? or is it the owner of a pest control company saying this !!!
Has this been proved ? or is it the owner of a pest control company saying this !!! CHARLIE TAYLOR
  • Score: 16

8:28am Tue 15 Apr 14

eurogordi says...

There has certainly been an increase in the rat population, but that is due to several mild winters and a rat's breeding capacity more than anything else.

I've had rats in my garden and I've noticed that traditional poisons are no longer working. Traps seem to be the only way at present.

But councils are pretty useless at controlling rats. My garden borders council property and that's were the rats are coming from.
There has certainly been an increase in the rat population, but that is due to several mild winters and a rat's breeding capacity more than anything else. I've had rats in my garden and I've noticed that traditional poisons are no longer working. Traps seem to be the only way at present. But councils are pretty useless at controlling rats. My garden borders council property and that's were the rats are coming from. eurogordi
  • Score: 11

8:32am Tue 15 Apr 14

kevinchandler100@talktalk.net says...

no its true iv seen the rats for my self.If you go into town round by the park opposite Laura Ashley shop were the buses turn back of pri mark about 9 pm you will see for your self. the rats are all over the place and there are some bigger ones in the city center called Councillors.
no its true iv seen the rats for my self.If you go into town round by the park opposite Laura Ashley shop were the buses turn back of pri mark about 9 pm you will see for your self. the rats are all over the place and there are some bigger ones in the city center called Councillors. kevinchandler100@talktalk.net
  • Score: 31

8:47am Tue 15 Apr 14

Paramjit Bahia says...

Why under the control of Cllr. Jacqui Rayment everything grows big?

When she was the Chair of Police Authority she created big mess and wasted millions on Alpha Park property, that ended in a huge loss.

There were big whoppers in press statement she'd signed off when Cllr. Keith Morrell resigned from the cabinet with the intention of telling the people whole truth about NuLabour's evil intention to implement cuts.

Under her The traffic jams are getting bigger and grid locks more frequent.

So hardly surprising now Southampton has also got the bigger rats .

Only change is that this time she has declined to open her big mouth and refused to provide Echo with comment over super rats.
Why under the control of Cllr. Jacqui Rayment everything grows big? When she was the Chair of Police Authority she created big mess and wasted millions on Alpha Park property, that ended in a huge loss. There were big whoppers in press statement she'd signed off when Cllr. Keith Morrell resigned from the cabinet with the intention of telling the people whole truth about NuLabour's evil intention to implement cuts. Under her The traffic jams are getting bigger and grid locks more frequent. So hardly surprising now Southampton has also got the bigger rats . Only change is that this time she has declined to open her big mouth and refused to provide Echo with comment over super rats. Paramjit Bahia
  • Score: 0

8:53am Tue 15 Apr 14

Brite Spark says...

The size of small cats, kitten size then?
The size of small cats, kitten size then? Brite Spark
  • Score: 8

8:55am Tue 15 Apr 14

Randoor says...

I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products Randoor
  • Score: 54

9:05am Tue 15 Apr 14

Franks Tank says...

Southampton - lovely town
Southampton - lovely town Franks Tank
  • Score: -10

9:10am Tue 15 Apr 14

Taskforce 141 says...

That's right, blame the students for the rats!

WTF!

Have a good hard look at Newtown/Bevois Valley area and tell me its all the students causing the rat problem!

I would say it is more to do with the inbreed poor excuses for human beings who find it acceptable to discard litter casually as they please!
That's right, blame the students for the rats! WTF! Have a good hard look at Newtown/Bevois Valley area and tell me its all the students causing the rat problem! I would say it is more to do with the inbreed poor excuses for human beings who find it acceptable to discard litter casually as they please! Taskforce 141
  • Score: 25

9:23am Tue 15 Apr 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Rats can spread some nasty diseases, Bubonic Plague was popular once, but I think that was spread by fleas rather than the rats themselves. More problematical is Leptospirosis which can also lead to Weill's Disease, no doubt there are experts out there that can enlighten us further.
Rats can spread some nasty diseases, Bubonic Plague was popular once, but I think that was spread by fleas rather than the rats themselves. More problematical is Leptospirosis which can also lead to Weill's Disease, no doubt there are experts out there that can enlighten us further. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

9:28am Tue 15 Apr 14

Outside of the Box says...

Rats the size of cats? That's nothing compared to the sewer rats that gather every night to the rear of Edelvale Rd, these rats even ride moped until all hours of the morning.
Rats the size of cats? That's nothing compared to the sewer rats that gather every night to the rear of Edelvale Rd, these rats even ride moped until all hours of the morning. Outside of the Box
  • Score: 12

9:45am Tue 15 Apr 14

OddlyPat says...

CHARLIE TAYLOR wrote:
Has this been proved ? or is it the owner of a pest control company saying this !!!
I have seen them! just take a walk through Central Parks very early in the morning and you will see them too! It was a matter of time that it would happen considering the amount of rubbish everywhere. The Council were warned of both the increase in the number and size months ago but chose to ignore it along with everything else they choose to ignore that is a health issue.
[quote][p][bold]CHARLIE TAYLOR[/bold] wrote: Has this been proved ? or is it the owner of a pest control company saying this !!![/p][/quote]I have seen them! just take a walk through Central Parks very early in the morning and you will see them too! It was a matter of time that it would happen considering the amount of rubbish everywhere. The Council were warned of both the increase in the number and size months ago but chose to ignore it along with everything else they choose to ignore that is a health issue. OddlyPat
  • Score: 7

10:02am Tue 15 Apr 14

peasant says...

Nothing compared to those rats in Westminster, as big as cars! Just take a look at Mr Pickles. All through over indulging at the trough of politics!!
Nothing compared to those rats in Westminster, as big as cars! Just take a look at Mr Pickles. All through over indulging at the trough of politics!! peasant
  • Score: 3

10:04am Tue 15 Apr 14

Brite Spark says...

Southampton, Boomtown Rats.
Southampton, Boomtown Rats. Brite Spark
  • Score: -3

10:19am Tue 15 Apr 14

now in the north says...

We should be sacking this pest control company as they don't seem to have managed to catch and kill one of these "cat sized" rats, or even photograph one!
The stock photo is not a wild rat either, its a pet/fancy rat!
We should be sacking this pest control company as they don't seem to have managed to catch and kill one of these "cat sized" rats, or even photograph one! The stock photo is not a wild rat either, its a pet/fancy rat! now in the north
  • Score: 1

10:19am Tue 15 Apr 14

Christy13 says...

If people were not as lazy and disposed of their rubbish correctly then this wouldn't become an increasing problem it's not the poor rats faults. The city is becoming far to populated and were all becoming sardines in a tiny can. Ridiculous
If people were not as lazy and disposed of their rubbish correctly then this wouldn't become an increasing problem it's not the poor rats faults. The city is becoming far to populated and were all becoming sardines in a tiny can. Ridiculous Christy13
  • Score: 7

10:24am Tue 15 Apr 14

OddlyPat says...

peasant wrote:
Nothing compared to those rats in Westminster, as big as cars! Just take a look at Mr Pickles. All through over indulging at the trough of politics!!
Nice one peasant :)
[quote][p][bold]peasant[/bold] wrote: Nothing compared to those rats in Westminster, as big as cars! Just take a look at Mr Pickles. All through over indulging at the trough of politics!![/p][/quote]Nice one peasant :) OddlyPat
  • Score: -6

10:47am Tue 15 Apr 14

GETREADY says...

Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
I'm sick and tired of hearing about Super Rats!!! and at last someone is also seeing sense! Mr Whelan certainly does have a bad habit of scare mongering!!!!! Just a way to try and drum up a bit more business! I too work for a pest control company in Hampshire and am finding that too many pest control companies (not just the small ones either) are using Super Rats as an excuse for not being able to control an infestation, this is because they lack knowledge, expertise, and thus carry out very poor treatments and baiting practices! I also agree with Randoor, that Brodifacoum should absolutely NOT be cleared for outdoor use.
[quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]I'm sick and tired of hearing about Super Rats!!! and at last someone is also seeing sense! Mr Whelan certainly does have a bad habit of scare mongering!!!!! Just a way to try and drum up a bit more business! I too work for a pest control company in Hampshire and am finding that too many pest control companies (not just the small ones either) are using Super Rats as an excuse for not being able to control an infestation, this is because they lack knowledge, expertise, and thus carry out very poor treatments and baiting practices! I also agree with Randoor, that Brodifacoum should absolutely NOT be cleared for outdoor use. GETREADY
  • Score: 5

11:06am Tue 15 Apr 14

bigfella777 says...

As night worker in the city I can tell you it is out of control, but it all the rubbish that they feed on, again people not taking responsibility for their actions and then blaming someone else.
There are people who could come in with a team of trained terriers and clean the parks out in no time, poison doesn't work.
As night worker in the city I can tell you it is out of control, but it all the rubbish that they feed on, again people not taking responsibility for their actions and then blaming someone else. There are people who could come in with a team of trained terriers and clean the parks out in no time, poison doesn't work. bigfella777
  • Score: 4

11:13am Tue 15 Apr 14

dc4306 says...

I was walking by Millers Pond just last night and two what I thought where cats ran across the path and it wasnt until I got closer that I realised they were in fact RATS.
I was walking by Millers Pond just last night and two what I thought where cats ran across the path and it wasnt until I got closer that I realised they were in fact RATS. dc4306
  • Score: 7

11:32am Tue 15 Apr 14

Positively4thStreet says...

I lived in my last house for over thirty years,and there were rats in my garden(and everyone else's)when I moved in,and there were rats there when I moved out.
After initially spending a few years trying to eradicate the problem,I realised I was fighting a losing battle,and gave up and learned to live with it.
Although we were aware of rats being out there,none of my family growing up,or any pets ever came to any harm,and the only thing I learned was to avoid giving the rats any nesting areas like woodpiles,or seldom used sheds,and not to put bird food out.
I lived in my last house for over thirty years,and there were rats in my garden(and everyone else's)when I moved in,and there were rats there when I moved out. After initially spending a few years trying to eradicate the problem,I realised I was fighting a losing battle,and gave up and learned to live with it. Although we were aware of rats being out there,none of my family growing up,or any pets ever came to any harm,and the only thing I learned was to avoid giving the rats any nesting areas like woodpiles,or seldom used sheds,and not to put bird food out. Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 6

12:14pm Tue 15 Apr 14

soobear says...

So no-one has called for the pied piper yet then?!
So no-one has called for the pied piper yet then?! soobear
  • Score: 0

12:28pm Tue 15 Apr 14

WalkingOnAWire says...

Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
Super post Randoor, very balanced and informative.

The Echo as ever is looking for a good headline and paying scant attention to the facts. Nice bit of advertorial for Mr Whelan's business though. It's almost as if that's what the article was designed to promote...
[quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]Super post Randoor, very balanced and informative. The Echo as ever is looking for a good headline and paying scant attention to the facts. Nice bit of advertorial for Mr Whelan's business though. It's almost as if that's what the article was designed to promote... WalkingOnAWire
  • Score: 8

1:51pm Tue 15 Apr 14

phil maccavity says...

WalkingOnAWire wrote:
Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
Super post Randoor, very balanced and informative.

The Echo as ever is looking for a good headline and paying scant attention to the facts. Nice bit of advertorial for Mr Whelan's business though. It's almost as if that's what the article was designed to promote...
Interesting to see that a very similar story was carried by the Liverpool Echo on 13th April
So either our Echo picked up the story and asked Mr Whelan for a comment or it was a good bit of self promotion by Mr Whelan in the two areas he does business
Whatever, it is a fact of life that rats have always been a problem but more so nowadays as a consequence of the lax attitude to litter taken by a growing number of people in this country.
Not only is this unsightly but also a potential hazard to health
[quote][p][bold]WalkingOnAWire[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]Super post Randoor, very balanced and informative. The Echo as ever is looking for a good headline and paying scant attention to the facts. Nice bit of advertorial for Mr Whelan's business though. It's almost as if that's what the article was designed to promote...[/p][/quote]Interesting to see that a very similar story was carried by the Liverpool Echo on 13th April So either our Echo picked up the story and asked Mr Whelan for a comment or it was a good bit of self promotion by Mr Whelan in the two areas he does business Whatever, it is a fact of life that rats have always been a problem but more so nowadays as a consequence of the lax attitude to litter taken by a growing number of people in this country. Not only is this unsightly but also a potential hazard to health phil maccavity
  • Score: 1

1:54pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Nutstrangler says...

So where is it that there are "Twice-weekly" bin collections ?
So where is it that there are "Twice-weekly" bin collections ? Nutstrangler
  • Score: 2

2:03pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Hdg end mo says...

I blame Roland rat and danger mouse
I blame Roland rat and danger mouse Hdg end mo
  • Score: 0

2:12pm Tue 15 Apr 14

peachy1 says...

Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
Good post however

At no point does he refer to them as super Rats

I think the press have called them this

I know whelan pest they are a very popular company

I have no doubt you all know what your doing

But slagging him off is out of order
[quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]Good post however At no point does he refer to them as super Rats I think the press have called them this I know whelan pest they are a very popular company I have no doubt you all know what your doing But slagging him off is out of order peachy1
  • Score: 3

2:12pm Tue 15 Apr 14

peachy1 says...

Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
Good post however

At no point does he refer to them as super Rats

I think the press have called them this

I know whelan pest they are a very popular company

I have no doubt you all know what your doing

But slagging him off is out of order
[quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]Good post however At no point does he refer to them as super Rats I think the press have called them this I know whelan pest they are a very popular company I have no doubt you all know what your doing But slagging him off is out of order peachy1
  • Score: 0

3:22pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Highfielder says...

The post by Randoor is one of the best and most informative I have ever read on an Echo thread. Not only is it better than the article it is commenting on but, even with a couple of spelling mistakes, it is up to the standard of most Echo journalists.
The post by Randoor is one of the best and most informative I have ever read on an Echo thread. Not only is it better than the article it is commenting on but, even with a couple of spelling mistakes, it is up to the standard of most Echo journalists. Highfielder
  • Score: 8

5:14pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Trixxie says...

On the estate we live on, the rats are feeding from the grain and bread people are scattering to feed the pigeons. Masses of food and grain is distributed regularly on our estate. It's difficult to complain about because then your life can be made very difficult, and the council doesn't seem to be very proactive in applying sanctions or enforcing rules. It just seems to expect council tax payers to carry on coughing up the money to pay the bills rather than start applying realistic sanctions alongside public education about hygiene. There are other causes too but this is a problem on my estate.
On the estate we live on, the rats are feeding from the grain and bread people are scattering to feed the pigeons. Masses of food and grain is distributed regularly on our estate. It's difficult to complain about because then your life can be made very difficult, and the council doesn't seem to be very proactive in applying sanctions or enforcing rules. It just seems to expect council tax payers to carry on coughing up the money to pay the bills rather than start applying realistic sanctions alongside public education about hygiene. There are other causes too but this is a problem on my estate. Trixxie
  • Score: 5

6:47pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Sweed says...

Mr Whelan's comment about family homes being used by students doesn't make much sense:

“There are a number of houses in town that used to be three or four-bedroom homes. But now they are student properties instead of families living in a big property.

“It means you have four individuals living in one house, so that’s four bins, and it means you get bags falling on to the street and food falling on to the pavement. "

I have lived in and been to many shared houses in Southampton, some lived in by students and some not, and I have never seen four bins for four individuals. At the most I have seen two, one normal waste and one recycling. Just like a family home.

I know students aren't perfect but clearly Mr Whelan isn't either.
Mr Whelan's comment about family homes being used by students doesn't make much sense: “There are a number of houses in town that used to be three or four-bedroom homes. But now they are student properties instead of families living in a big property. “It means you have four individuals living in one house, so that’s four bins, and it means you get bags falling on to the street and food falling on to the pavement. " I have lived in and been to many shared houses in Southampton, some lived in by students and some not, and I have never seen four bins for four individuals. At the most I have seen two, one normal waste and one recycling. Just like a family home. I know students aren't perfect but clearly Mr Whelan isn't either. Sweed
  • Score: 3

7:58pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Stubs says...

I was in town last week and I saw a massive rat near the park. It most of been about 3ft high and very aggressive looking creature. Thank god I was in my mobility scooter and enabled a swift getaway.
I was in town last week and I saw a massive rat near the park. It most of been about 3ft high and very aggressive looking creature. Thank god I was in my mobility scooter and enabled a swift getaway. Stubs
  • Score: -2

8:37pm Tue 15 Apr 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Get yourself a Jack Russell, no rat gets close to mine and lives to tell the tale.
Get yourself a Jack Russell, no rat gets close to mine and lives to tell the tale. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 3

9:19pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Positively4thStreet says...

Trixxie wrote:
On the estate we live on, the rats are feeding from the grain and bread people are scattering to feed the pigeons. Masses of food and grain is distributed regularly on our estate. It's difficult to complain about because then your life can be made very difficult, and the council doesn't seem to be very proactive in applying sanctions or enforcing rules. It just seems to expect council tax payers to carry on coughing up the money to pay the bills rather than start applying realistic sanctions alongside public education about hygiene. There are other causes too but this is a problem on my estate.
Bird food doesn't help if you want to discourage rats,but no matter what anyone does, rats will always be with us,and unfortunately its just something we have to get used to;a bit like when the kids come home from school with nits in their hair...that's life.
[quote][p][bold]Trixxie[/bold] wrote: On the estate we live on, the rats are feeding from the grain and bread people are scattering to feed the pigeons. Masses of food and grain is distributed regularly on our estate. It's difficult to complain about because then your life can be made very difficult, and the council doesn't seem to be very proactive in applying sanctions or enforcing rules. It just seems to expect council tax payers to carry on coughing up the money to pay the bills rather than start applying realistic sanctions alongside public education about hygiene. There are other causes too but this is a problem on my estate.[/p][/quote]Bird food doesn't help if you want to discourage rats,but no matter what anyone does, rats will always be with us,and unfortunately its just something we have to get used to;a bit like when the kids come home from school with nits in their hair...that's life. Positively4thStreet
  • Score: -1

10:39pm Tue 15 Apr 14

gristle says...

Giant spotted rats eh. I smell a ----------
Giant spotted rats eh. I smell a ---------- gristle
  • Score: -1

10:44pm Tue 15 Apr 14

southamptonadi says...

But the anti hunt brigade say don't kill foxes they keep the rat population down. Er we'll no apparently

And before you start there are hundreds of foxes living in southampton seen many in the Fremantle area. The docks are full of them
But the anti hunt brigade say don't kill foxes they keep the rat population down. Er we'll no apparently And before you start there are hundreds of foxes living in southampton seen many in the Fremantle area. The docks are full of them southamptonadi
  • Score: -2

9:25am Wed 16 Apr 14

Dr Martin says...

http://www.bbc.co.uk
/news/world-europe-2
6764929
http://www.bbc.co.uk /news/world-europe-2 6764929 Dr Martin
  • Score: 0

11:40am Wed 16 Apr 14

finding#nemo says...

Randoor wrote:
I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats.
Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK.

This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago.

The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them.

The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison.

What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic.

As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public.

For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down!

The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected.

So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife.

The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products
How come someone discredits what Mr Whelan is saying then goes on to agree with almost everything he said in the first place in not so many ways and write an essay on it? I'm not supprised that the council did not comment to be honest, they might then have to spend some of our money on doing something for the people of southampton.
[quote][p][bold]Randoor[/bold] wrote: I work for a pest control company in the city and the comments made by Mr Whelan is just scare mongering regarding super rats. Firstly, Super Rats. So let’s cut through the myths – so Super rats are not huge rats twice the size of normal rats, with enormous teeth and growing to the size of a labrador. Niether do they have any greater or lesser intelligence, better climbing abilities or worse personal hygiene or carry more diseases. The only difference between the common Brown Rat and a Super Rat is a gene. Basically, over the years of being subjected to poisons of a certain type, they have genetically mutated to be resistent to the effects of Bromodiolone and Difenacoum – the two most commonly used poisons in the UK. This all came about through poor baiting practices, where tons of bait was thrown about, killing many rats, but also leaving survivors, who having eaten the poison but did not die. As these rats bread, the gene mutated and slowly but surely, Super Rats evolved. In nature, evolution always finds a way to survive, otherwise a pest species like the Brown Rat would have been annihilated years ago. The answer to this problem is to use different formulations – some say more toxic, some do not – but basically a poison is a poison in any form and is designed to kill anything that consumes it. What people do not realise is all poisons must be used correctly to avoid threats to people, pets, children and wildlife. They are used to control a target species and so nothing else should gain access to them. The biggest concern is something called secondary poisoning. This can come in many forms, but basically, secondary poisoning occurs when any non target species comes into contract with a substance that is poisoned. This can be birds accessing the poison, or predators eating a carcass of an animal or bird which has consumed the poison. What pest controllers and rodent experts are calling for is to use poisons which are designated indoor use only in certain outdoor applications. We have been using these poisons for many years indoors and they are very effective, have no known resistance and kill very quickly. Comparing the two types, lets say indoor and outdoor poison for ease, the typical killing cycle of indoor poisons is 4 – 7 days, where as outdoor poisons are 20 – 30 days. The amount of poison needed to kill for indoor poisons is approx 1.4 grammes for Brodifacoum where as the outdoor poisons require approx 5.6 for bromodiolone and 9 grammes for Difenacoum, so yes it is deemed to be more toxic. As this is deemed more toxic, these products should not be allowed to be sold to the general public, but only to pest professionals who are trained in there use and the risks associated to using them to our wildlife. In fact, I actually think NO poisons should be sold to the general public. For instance, on a recent visit to a house where the owners had been trying for several months to get rid of a rat problem, I found poison on the bird table! Their reason for this was because it was called rat poison, they did not think anything else would be affected and it just killed rats! Now I know not everybody thinks that way, but not many people do a risk assessment or an environmental impact survey when they put poison down! The other point to note is that Super Rats only effect certain parts of the country, Berkshire, Hampshire and Oxfordshire being the most effected in the South of England. Analysis by Dr Alan Buckle of University of Reading shows that pretty much all samples provided in these areas carry the gene, but we are still getting good results using Bromodiolone (outdoor poison) in a few area. We are however having to use trapping, shooting and gassing more frequently now than ever before (these are the only other methods we can use outdoors), but these methods also have a safety/environmental impact for non target species. It is also fair to say that other genetic strains are popping up in different parts of the country, Birmingham and certain areas in Scotland are being affected. So whats the answer? We are looking for controlled and restricted use of Indoor poisons for certain outdoor applications, by suitably qualified pest controllers. We do not believe access should be granted to farmers and gamekeepers unless they are also suitably trained. Access for the general public of all poisons should be highly restricted and even stopped. In Mainland Europe and America, these indoor poisons have been used outside for sometime, without adverse effects of wildlife. The whole point of all this is to kill public health pests like Brown Rats and protect our wildlife – 2 issues I think we all can agree on – but the argument is how to do it and by whom. A code of practice is already in place and followed by the CRRU members who have achieved the Wildlife Aware Accrerditation, so I am guessing this would be a good minimum criteria for access to these products[/p][/quote]How come someone discredits what Mr Whelan is saying then goes on to agree with almost everything he said in the first place in not so many ways and write an essay on it? I'm not supprised that the council did not comment to be honest, they might then have to spend some of our money on doing something for the people of southampton. finding#nemo
  • Score: 2

2:17pm Wed 16 Apr 14

dolomiteman says...

Highfielder wrote:
The post by Randoor is one of the best and most informative I have ever read on an Echo thread. Not only is it better than the article it is commenting on but, even with a couple of spelling mistakes, it is up to the standard of most Echo journalists.
I agree Randoors post is very informative and well written, The Echo Editors could learn something here but why would they change their policy of overhyping and scaremongering with the only evidence of the cat sized rats being hearsay from someone who has a reason to scare people into using his services.
Lets see some photo's taken in Southampton of these cat sized rats and no a photo of a small pet rat to back up the Echo's story.
[quote][p][bold]Highfielder[/bold] wrote: The post by Randoor is one of the best and most informative I have ever read on an Echo thread. Not only is it better than the article it is commenting on but, even with a couple of spelling mistakes, it is up to the standard of most Echo journalists.[/p][/quote]I agree Randoors post is very informative and well written, The Echo Editors could learn something here but why would they change their policy of overhyping and scaremongering with the only evidence of the cat sized rats being hearsay from someone who has a reason to scare people into using his services. Lets see some photo's taken in Southampton of these cat sized rats and no a photo of a small pet rat to back up the Echo's story. dolomiteman
  • Score: -1

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