Heritage group plan to revamp Southampton Docks (From Daily Echo)
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Heritage group plan to revamp Southampton Docks
1:39pm Wednesday 27th May 2009 in
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- By Peter Law » Feature Writer
AN ambitious vision to restore Southampton’s old docks to their glory days has been unveiled by the city’s heritage champions.
Proponents say it will be like stepping back in time to Southampton in the 1920s or 30s, when the docks were filled with passenger liners.
Restored trams ferrying passengers in and out of the docks and historic vessels moored at the quayside are just two of the attractions proposed by the Southampton Heritage Federation.
It is the second proposed waterfront development to be revealed, after the Daily Echo reported on plans for a 10,000- seat arena at Royal Pier and Mayflower Park.
Port bosses ABP have offered the federation a three-year licence to develop the waterfront site, which lies directly behind the £19m Ocean Terminal in the Eastern Docks, into a maritime heritage attraction.
It is hoped the yet-to-be-named attraction will be popular both with residents and the thousands of passengers that will pass through the city’s fourth cruise terminal, which opened earlier this month.
Southampton City Council, which has already given its backing to the project, and the Heritage Lottery Fund, will both be approached to help fund the scheme. Future development funding for the Royal Pier project could also be tapped into.
Solent Sky curator Alan Jones, a member of the federation, revealed plans to link the attraction to any future development at Royal Pier via a restored tram line running along the quay.
As previously reported by the Echo, engineering experts at the University of Southampton have been asked by the council to see if the city’s existing tram tracks could be brought back into operation.
In the short term,work will begin on redeveloping the abandoned Trafalgar dry dock, while historic vessels such as the restored tug tender Calshot will be permanently moored at berths 50 and 51.
A 104-year-old pump house, which once opened the dock’s enormous gates, could also be restored to its former glory, though is likely to remain out of working order.
Mr Jones said ABP’s commitment to the project gave him confidence it would succeed where other heritage schemes had failed in the past.
“My vision is that you will feel like you have stepped back in time more than 70 years. It is not just part of the port, but a historically important site,” he said.
Plans for a state-of the-art arena at Royal Pier – which could also include a convention centre, casino and observation tower – are to be unveiled at the Southampton Boat Show in September.
They have been drawn up by Scottish-based developers Kilmartin, who were last July awarded an 18-month exclusivity contract to create a masterplan for the waterfront.
Restaurateur Kuti Miah’s Thai eatery in the Royal Pavilion will remain unaffected and it is hoped the proposed 180ft tribute to the Spitfire will also be incorporated at Town Quay.
Comments(19)
goard
says...
2:03pm Wed 27 May 09
goard
MangaFace
says...
2:09pm Wed 27 May 09
goard wrote:Cheer up. Boo hoo. waaaaaambulance. my life. wobble. wabble. weep. oppopopopposite my face.
God help us! An arena seating 10,000, apartment blocks, a mishmash of buildings with an untidy dock front - including OUR MAYFLOWER PARK!! I remember the Olde days, grandfather use to be a diver there and the docks looked a mess but an orderly mess - I bet ABI are laughing up their sleeves talk about revenge! Three years they are giving us to build this old worlde charm, Well it only takes about 1 week to build tin shacks, so we have plenty of time. goard
Redback
says...
2:17pm Wed 27 May 09
Boris Remmington
says...
2:57pm Wed 27 May 09
allsaintsnocurves
says...
3:32pm Wed 27 May 09
stoney79
says...
3:33pm Wed 27 May 09
Mr Ploppy
says...
4:07pm Wed 27 May 09
I used to work for them, so therefore I should also know. Real cloak 'n' dagger stuff with plenty of people feathering their own nests.
But the worst of it all was the COMPLETE LACK OF VISION these idiots have. Thousands of pounds wasted, no, millions of pounds wasted, every year, for these amazing schemes and ideas yet with no intention of carrying it through.
I'm not sure why the solution to pretty much everything is to build flats for 'young professionals' everywhere.
In 6 months you'll have to issue a complete climb down about his story when the SCC decides that more flats would be an effective use of the land in the city. Again.
When I do eventually buy a place back in the UK, I will be heading to Portsmouth or Bournemouth, there is no way I'm heading back to this sh1thole anytime soon. At least both of their councils have been progressive, forward thinking and in touch with their local community.
And anyway... why the fack would anyone want to restore anything back to the standard of the 1930's??? If you are going to do something, bring it up to date...!
Our port used to be known as 'The Gateway To The World'... and if only we had a city to make such a grand statement. Currently, those lucky enough to have this sh1thole on their itinerary have to walk through dilapidated docks full of containers, hairy arsed men and seagull sh1t, then through an industrial estate (see above for frequent clientele), then dodge the deathtrap that is west quay road just to get to our 'flagship' attractions. A shopping mall (wooo, great...! couldn't do that in America! Or Italy! Or Spain!) a pathetic titanic memorial and quite ridiculous aviation museum (actually, is that even still open?) ... ohhh the choices! decisions decisions! not only that, but lucky visitors might get to taste the local hospitality if they wander around long enough... and that comes with a free trip to the hospital/police station or if you are lucky enough, both.
soton1980
says...
6:11pm Wed 27 May 09
Mr Ploppy wrote:I agree with you.
I am from Southampton. I am delighted I no longer live there. Not only is the city riddled with carrot-crunching morons, feral youths and pretentious knobbers, it also has quite simply the worst City Council in living history.
I used to work for them, so therefore I should also know. Real cloak 'n' dagger stuff with plenty of people feathering their own nests.
But the worst of it all was the COMPLETE LACK OF VISION these idiots have. Thousands of pounds wasted, no, millions of pounds wasted, every year, for these amazing schemes and ideas yet with no intention of carrying it through.
I'm not sure why the solution to pretty much everything is to build flats for 'young professionals' everywhere.
In 6 months you'll have to issue a complete climb down about his story when the SCC decides that more flats would be an effective use of the land in the city. Again.
When I do eventually buy a place back in the UK, I will be heading to Portsmouth or Bournemouth, there is no way I'm heading back to this sh1thole anytime soon. At least both of their councils have been progressive, forward thinking and in touch with their local community.
And anyway... why the fack would anyone want to restore anything back to the standard of the 1930's??? If you are going to do something, bring it up to date...!
Our port used to be known as 'The Gateway To The World'... and if only we had a city to make such a grand statement. Currently, those lucky enough to have this sh1thole on their itinerary have to walk through dilapidated docks full of containers, hairy arsed men and seagull sh1t, then through an industrial estate (see above for frequent clientele), then dodge the deathtrap that is west quay road just to get to our 'flagship' attractions. A shopping mall (wooo, great...! couldn't do that in America! Or Italy! Or Spain!) a pathetic titanic memorial and quite ridiculous aviation museum (actually, is that even still open?) ... ohhh the choices! decisions decisions! not only that, but lucky visitors might get to taste the local hospitality if they wander around long enough... and that comes with a free trip to the hospital/police station or if you are lucky enough, both.
As I've said many a time before, Ocean Village used to be great when I was a youngster, till the council and developers ruined it. It had so much potential to become a rival to Gunwharf Quays with cafes,restaurants, a few upmarket clubs and some decent shops. Add in a tram link from town and it would have been so fantastic and a real boom to the city.
Instead they made a complete **** up of it and put loads of flats there. It just seems lifeless now.
Every new development/tall building is flats or a hotel with no vision to create any decent tourist attractions.
I still think Southampton is a better city than Portsmouth with SOOOOO much potential, but the differnce is that Portsmouth City Council have more vision for their city.
If I were a tourist, There would be plenty of pull factors to make me want to visit Portsmouth such as the Spinnaker Tower/Mary Rose Museum/Historic Docks.
I can't think of what Southampton has. West Quay is a very good shopping centre, but the council needs to stop being stupid by assuming that people only visit cities for shopping.
Redback
says...
7:27pm Wed 27 May 09
The people that live here have to stop being defensive about the place and get angry instead.
It's a total disgrace of a city.
Ben Doone
says...
8:19pm Wed 27 May 09
Couple of points from the Echo piece. The Port is now three times the physical size than in the so called 'glory days' of the 1920's/1930's and handles five times the cargo tonnage.
Also, as I understand it, the piece of land on offer is along the frontage of the old Trafalgar Dry Dock and part of 50 berth.
Three quarters of the old Dry Dock is now infilled and houses the site of the new Cruise Terminal
Redback
says...
8:48pm Wed 27 May 09
Mr Ploppy
says...
9:00pm Wed 27 May 09
I too used to go there as a youngster... perfect for a sunday day out... laserquest/quaser, anyone?
The mahoosive turning point was when Ocean Village simply wilted away and died and the area was prime for renovation, prime for a Gunwharf like redevelopment, ideal for pubs, clubs, restaurants, bars... which could have been at least the 2nd best place for a night out on the south coast (to Bmouth.) We could have redeveloped the whole area right the way through... ****, it is so frustrating. Why, oh why was this allowed to happen? Y'know, I'm not that doubtful about the rumours of brown paper envelopes and backhanders at all. Anyway, regardless, that is speculation.
The fact still remains though that once they did plonk all those flats and professionals apartments on that plot that it will never, ever, in our lifetime become anything other than that.
I spent alot of time in Portsmouth last year and simply marvelled at how beautiful their city was. I did remember the 'old' Portsmouth Tricorn 'n' all and was staggered by the regeneration of the city. Like any city, there are still some bad areas but on the whole the amenities, history, tourism attractions and simple beauty far outweigh Southampton's.
And my God, it's frustrating.
Like you, I do believe we have plenty of history and heritage and tourist worthy themes to celebrate as a city, and we, like Portsmouth have, need to embrace them. Renovate the aviation museum, make a fitting Titanic memorial and museum... what about a WWII museum? Even better, why dont we have a just a Southampton museum with everything under one roof?
Still doesn't change the fact that we missed out on a opportunity to be at the forefront of regenerating our city and giving its residents a city to be proud of.
And horriby, I cannot see this malaise lifting anytime soon.
By the way, you have to be facking mental to think ther is nothing wrong with Southampton. I've been fortunate to travel and see quite a few cities and Southampton is without doubt one of the worst - and, worth mentioning and expanding on another time - one of the most unfriendly.
Ben Doone
says...
10:11pm Wed 27 May 09
I expect you and I are children of different generations so will therefore see things from different perspectives. I have travelled extensively too and if you think crossing West Quay Rd dangerous then not sure what you make of the main coast road down past Marbella!!
Agree with you that developers in p'mouth have made a good job with Gunwharf, but apart from this area and old Portsmouth, are you seriously promoting the rest of Portsea Island as a nirvana of peace and tranquility. To me the majority of Portsea is reminiscent of a old Northern mill town transplanted to the south coast!!
Similarly B'mouth appears to be a pleasant place to live but scratch the surface and there are a significant drug problems and parts of Poole are, using the modern idiom, quite 'tasty', at times.
BrixtonSaint
says...
8:59am Thu 28 May 09
allowed the Ocean Terminal to be demolished. Can you imagine that
happening today? It would have grade one listed status. I suspect and
hope even the 60's ferry passenger hall in the new dock would have
some sort of protection. The OT would have had liner passengers
clambering over themselves on the forward deck to see that coming up
the Solent & then experience those panelled walls as they came
through. Either that or it should have been the hub of what
Southampton's waterside was about for the past 30 years. And now they
want to return to the 30,s. That council is a major reason I new my
future lay elsewhere, it really is atrocious what they've allowed to
go on over the years. It makes you wonder.
Ben Doone
says...
9:30am Thu 28 May 09
However, at the time the building was demolished (mid 80's?), passenger shipping had fallen away and the port required the berth and quay space for cargo activity so the port operators had to make a commercial decision. Changing trade patterns and mechanisation means that very few of the ports old buildings now remain.
Also the O Terminal's internal layout would not have been particularly conducive for modern cruise activity.
Separately whilst I hold no particular brief for Soton City Council they do seem to get maligned in most posts.
As I read it the planned heritage centre is a private initiative, assisted by ABp with a 3 yr option on the land and supported in principle by the Council. There is no Taxpayers money involved as yet. It appears the project will live or die on the basis of Heritage Funding.
I am sure if the Council had not supported the outline plan they would have been criticised, so a no-win situation for them.
Perhaps the positive here is we are able to consider and discuss these things. I guess the worst thing would be if there were no plans to improve/develop the city.
goard
says...
10:44am Thu 28 May 09
Goard
Ben Doone
says...
2:33pm Thu 28 May 09
goard wrote:Hi Goard,
Ben Doone, all those opposing the planning of Soton are horrified at the wanton destruction of the one bit of land (along this side of the Solent) in planning a built up area that no public can access. Sadly, Soton had the opportunity to resurrect the industrial side with, hopefully, a tiny piece of land for the public to enjoy - i.e., a Royal Pier and a piece of land to stroll, but what do they want to do - build 100,000 stadium and casino. Of course my little kids will be there all the time. Those lovely boats we see (if not hidden by great tin sheds and containers) maybe here today but when a better offer comes along they will be OFF! and Council and Planners with the ability of a gnat will also be gone. That is why many of us cry out at what has been done to OUR SOUTHAMPTON. Goard
Not exactly sure what you mean by wanton destruction but, as
far as I am aware, plans for the Royal Pier will... 1)maintain Mayflower Park as a public amenity (and there is a laid down legal provision for this)..
2)considerably improve public access along the revamped waterfront and... 3)get rid of the eyesore that is Royal pier.
Of course you could leave the area as it is which I believe would be a wasted opportunity.
Perhaps you could ask the City Council to fund a different redevelopment but they dont own any waterfront land and your rates would have to go up significantly to pay for any costs involved.
So the only development potential is via private investors. Apparently a(nother) casino is a commercial option as are flats and retail/entertainment and possibly a 10,000 capacity Town Arena.
A mixed commercial development is the most logical solution and will benefit the city with increased rate income and revenue from visitors.This is the model that the Gunwharf developers followed in portsmouth something which is much vaunted by many posters on here.
Finally I am constantly surprised how few local residents use Mayflower Park and Town Quay. Whenever I'm home, on a sunny day, I like to have a stroll round with an ice cream watching the ships and other activity. Apart from the ice cream and relatively inexpensive parking, it's free!!
BrixtonSaint
says...
5:22pm Wed 17 Jun 09
As for the park itself, you're right, it could be utilised so much more. The council of course could do so much more with it as I and others have mentioned in comments on the Arena story. First off is get shot of the bloody road that slices the park in two and put in a hairpin r/about so cars simply return from whence they came. The play area could be further developed and still leave space for events where temporary marquees or fencing for gigs could be installed as well as having free council run events like a summertime big screen. It's easy, there's just no imagination at SCC
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MangaFace says...
1:45pm Wed 27 May 09