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Big names draw up plans for ice rink
10:36am Friday 29th August 2008
Comments (93)
By Peter Law »
TWO of the biggest names in Britain's leisure industry are drawing up plans to build an ice rink in the heart of Southampton, the Daily Echo can today exclusively reveal.
Two top-secret sites have been identified in the city centre and the rival developers are in advanced talks with Southamp-ton City Council.
The development comes after campaigners last week rallied through Southampton calling for a new ice rink 20 years to the day after the city's Top Rank rink closed down.
Marching under the banner of United Southampton Skaters (USS), the skaters, ice hockey players and ice dancers handed a Daily Echo backed petition with 5,000 signatures to the council.
Details of the rink proposals are a closely guarded secret but the Echo has learnt both operators have met with the council to discuss their vision.
One of the proposed sites is on private land near the waterfront, while the second is an inner city area of part private and publicly owned land.
USS organiser Natalie Murphy said: "It would be superb if this happens. We will be waiting with baited breath but we have seen schemes come and go before. If these developers are serious then what they need to do is work with USS."
Fellow organiser Edna Boden said: "If it's true it's great news. As long as hopes are not going to be dashed again."
Kerry Payne, chairman of Southampton Ice Dance and Figure Skating Club, added: "I will believe it when I see it. We've heard this flannel before."
The Echo understands one proposal is to build an ice rink as part of multi-million winter sports complex.
As revealed by the Echo in February, developers X-Leisure want to build a giant snow dome that would feature a 200m slope covered with tonnes of fresh snow everyday.
Xscape Southampton could attract up to four million visitors a year from across the south and pump millions into the local economy.
The council hopes an ice rink could be an attraction alongside shops, bars, restaurants and other activities such as indoor skydiving, rock climbing and a skateboard park. Xscape has already proved hugely successful in Milton Keynes, Leeds and Glasgow.
Councillor John Hannides, Cabinet member for leisure, confirmed the council had met with the developers.
He said the Conservative administration wanted to attract operators who could run the ice rink at a profit.
"We have gone beyond anything that has been done by any previous administration to attract potential operators to Southampton to the point that we are pursuing opportunities that have never been considered," he said.
"We are investing a lot of time and energy to make this happen. We are acting as a facilitator by helping to bring together the players to make this happen."
Any development is still "years" away from starting construction, but Cllr Hannides said one developer was already investigating the potential popularity of the rink.
Your Say YourEcho
clair, Soton Icering? says...
11:05am Fri 29 Aug 08
I am so suspicious nowadays.
clair
Gilmore, Shirley, Southampton says...
11:07am Fri 29 Aug 08
We have gone beyond anything that has been done by any previous administration to attract potential operators to Southampton
To me this looks like Council waving and their arms and proclaiming "See?! We're doing something!! We're actually doing something!" When in fact they're just dangling a carrot to secure their next election victory.
"We are acting as a facilitator by helping to bring together the players to make this happen"
Any development is still "years" away from starting construction
A vote for the Conservatives is a vote for possibly, maybe getting an ice rink if you're lucky in the next 20 years.
southy, redbridge says...
11:37am Fri 29 Aug 08
Gilmore, Shirley, Southampton says...
11:49am Fri 29 Aug 08
southy wrote:Source..?
there's going to be 10 new ice rinks built in the uk.
Paramjit Bahia, Southampton says...
11:56am Fri 29 Aug 08
But in fairness the nasty party has now made it absolutely clear that they are not going to facilitate Ice Rink either by subsidising or with cheap land deals etc. In the past all three main parties were misleading even on that point.
While I do not like selling public land the fact is that Council sold the land at reduced price to a Mosque (Was supported by all three main parties) and has provided massive grants to religious organisations. (For providing working classes with opium!) Although I will not but others could argue if it can be done for religion then why not for leisure and sports.
George, says...
11:56am Fri 29 Aug 08
THE BRICK wrote:Typical response from you, really, based on what you'd like to think, rather than the actual facts of the matter. I never said it wouldn't be successful. I said that a petition of 5000 signatures and a demand that it be built was not proof that an ice rink would be popular. In your desperation to gloat, you once more ignored actual facts.
Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!
It isn't 100% anyway, the plug can still be pulled. Hopefully it won't, but you never know.
George, says...
12:03pm Fri 29 Aug 08
The Echo understands one proposal is to build an ice rink as part of multi-million winter sports complex.
As said all along by "the neggies", the only way it could be sustainable is as part of a larger complex.
Any development is still "years" away from starting construction
Doesn't sound like 100% success to me.
southy, redbridge says...
12:21pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Gilmore wrote:you need to be in the know at the moment.but when the time comes it will be publish,and the 10 towns/citys that will get them,it be publish in paper way before you see it on the internet,so i suggjest that you kept going to the library and look at the white paper
southy wrote:Source..?
there\'s going to be 10 new ice rinks built in the uk.
Who cares, Southampton says...
12:33pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy, redbridge says...
12:33pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Who cares wrote:yes
Does anyone actually want an ice rink, besides the skating club?
Who cares, So'ton says...
12:35pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy, redbridge says...
12:41pm Fri 29 Aug 08
George, says...
12:45pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy wrote:Seconded, actually. I want one. Not to the extent that I want to force it on a city that doesn't want it, but I still want one, regardless.
yes
Christoff, says...
12:51pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Who cares wrote:not bothered either way. I would be one of those once a year users
Does anyone actually want an ice rink, besides the skating club?
THE BRICK, @THE ICE RINK says...
1:47pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Just can't please you can we.
USS have said that the council should build a rink. Our petition asked the council to invite developers into the city and assist them in development.
That is what the council have now done and there are two potential discussions going on . Therefore our campaign has been successful insofar that the council are talking about it.
George, I know you would like to see an ice rink, but now there is news about 2 developers with interest how can you say that the campaign was not successful?
USS are not gloating, once again we are stating fact, thats all.
Ian Hoolihan, says...
1:57pm Fri 29 Aug 08
THE BRICK wrote:so what is it, USS or USC???
Typical response from you, really, based on what you'd like to think, rather than the actual facts of the matter. I never said it wouldn't be successful. I said that a petition of 5000 signatures and a demand that it be built was not proof that an ice rink would be popular. In your desperation to gloat, you once more ignored actual facts.{/QUOTE] Just can't please you can we. USS have said that the council should build a rink. Our petition asked the council to invite developers into the city and assist them in development. That is what the council have now done and there are two potential discussions going on . Therefore our campaign has been successful insofar that the council are talking about it. George, I know you would like to see an ice rink, but now there is news about 2 developers with interest how can you say that the campaign was not successful? USS are not gloating, once again we are stating fact, thats all.
southy, redbridge says...
1:58pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Tony, Southampton says...
1:59pm Fri 29 Aug 08
The old rink closed because Rank could make more money by selling the site for housing than they could make from skating at the rink. That doesn't necessarily mean the rink was unprofitable.
But anybody building a new one will have to recover the substantial capital costs involved in building it and in purchasing the land. This is a huge risk for any developer if it can't be clearly shown that there's sufficient demand in the area to support additional ice rinks to those in places like Basingstoke.
John Hannides may think he's going further than any previous administration but I do know that previous administrations spent a great deal of officer and memebr time on trying to forge a partnership with various developers so that the risk was split between council and private operator to make building a rink more likely. I know that discussions were at a very advanced stage - I suspect more advanced than the current plans - to build a rink combined with swimming pool on the site where The Quays now stands. The Council was confident it would go ahead but it didn't because the developer wanted the council to bear virtually all of the risk.
If John Hannides has found a developer ready to take on all of the risk then good luck to him. But, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it.
George, says...
2:00pm Fri 29 Aug 08
George, I know you would like to see an ice rink, but now there is news about 2 developers with interest how can you say that the campaign was not successful?
Do you have some medical condition that prevents you from quoting what you've read properly? I said it was not yet 100% successful. Which is true. Only once the thing is actually built and opened can you say the campaign was a success. You're ignoring what is being said in favour of setting up straw men to refute. As usual.
You play or watch ice hockey, right? If, by the end of the first half, your team is 5 points up, do you then consider the game a victory? Or do you wait until the final result?
George, says...
2:01pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Tony wrote:No no, Tony, the campaign has been a 100% success! There's nothing more to say! Can't you read? </sarcasm>
We've been through this "city on brink of new ice rink" so many times that I will not believe it until I see it.
The old rink closed because Rank could make more money by selling the site for housing than they could make from skating at the rink. That doesn't necessarily mean the rink was unprofitable.
But anybody building a new one will have to recover the substantial capital costs involved in building it and in purchasing the land. This is a huge risk for any developer if it can't be clearly shown that there's sufficient demand in the area to support additional ice rinks to those in places like Basingstoke.
John Hannides may think he's going further than any previous administration but I do know that previous administrations spent a great deal of officer and memebr time on trying to forge a partnership with various developers so that the risk was split between council and private operator to make building a rink more likely. I know that discussions were at a very advanced stage - I suspect more advanced than the current plans - to build a rink combined with swimming pool on the site where The Quays now stands. The Council was confident it would go ahead but it didn't because the developer wanted the council to bear virtually all of the risk.
If John Hannides has found a developer ready to take on all of the risk then good luck to him. But, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it.
Gilmore, Shirley, Southampton says...
2:02pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy wrote:Which white paper would this be, bro? And how will I know when I've found it? I've never been down to the records department, I tend to stick to the picture books and DVDs ;)
Gilmore wrote:you need to be in the know at the moment.but when the time comes it will be publish,and the 10 towns/citys that will get them,it be publish in paper way before you see it on the internet,so i suggjest that you kept going to the library and look at the white papersouthy wrote: there\\\'s going to be 10 new ice rinks built in the uk.Source..?
southy, redbridge says...
2:04pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Tony, Southampton said
The old rink closed because Rank could make more money by selling the site for housing than they could make from skating at the rink. That doesn't necessarily mean the rink was unprofitable
this is true but selling land to build houses is short term and the quick buck the one of payment,where has an ice rink will bring in money all the time
southy, redbridge says...
2:09pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Which white paper would this be, bro? And how will I know when I've found it? I've never been down to the records department, I tend to stick to the picture books and DVDs ;)
lol Gilmore, Shirley,
kebab man, still with you george says...
2:10pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Grown up Skater, Totton says...
2:11pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Gilmore, Shirley, Southampton says...
2:25pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy wrote:The white paper's in Shirley, you say? Cool, that's where I live!
Which white paper would this be, bro? And how will I know when I\'ve found it? I\'ve never been down to the records department, I tend to stick to the picture books and DVDs ;)lol Gilmore, Shirley,
Unconvinced, says...
2:33pm Fri 29 Aug 08
THE BRICK wrote:I dont see any 100% success.
Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!
Where is this 100% success you claim?
All I see is the Echo lamely trying to justify its public campaign by spinning more unsubstantiated rumour, another red herring and throwing yet another bone your way.
All I see is froth and nonsense.
All I see is wishful thinking.
All I see is idle speculation.
What I dont see, is a proposal.
What I dont see, is hard evidence.
What I dont see is a business plan.
So, an ice rink remains a pipe dream.
Pie in the sky.
An albatross.
A fantasy.
A fairy-tale.
It aint gonna happen.
The economic climate will not support the necessary investment, either in terms of funding the project or in terms of generating solid income from bodies going through the turnstile or buying tickets.
You may have more success with tiddleywinks as a pastime, rather than huffing and puffing about this ludicrous
notion of millions of pounds being poured into a white elephant of an idea.
southy, redbridge says...
2:33pm Fri 29 Aug 08
the main library you could try shirley see what they got been a long time when i was last in there
Dr Alimantado, says...
2:46pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy wrote:sense of humour failure.
in town Gilmore, Shirley. the main library you could try shirley see what they got been a long time when i was last in there
You do need to get out of the library a little more often
Ian Hoolihan, says...
2:47pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Unconvinced wrote:I think you should stop sitting on the fence
THE BRICK wrote: Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!I dont see any 100% success. Where is this 100% success you claim? All I see is the Echo lamely trying to justify its public campaign by spinning more unsubstantiated rumour, another red herring and throwing yet another bone your way. All I see is froth and nonsense. All I see is wishful thinking. All I see is idle speculation. What I dont see, is a proposal. What I dont see, is hard evidence. What I dont see is a business plan. So, an ice rink remains a pipe dream. Pie in the sky. An albatross. A fantasy. A fairy-tale. It aint gonna happen. The economic climate will not support the necessary investment, either in terms of funding the project or in terms of generating solid income from bodies going through the turnstile or buying tickets. You may have more success with tiddleywinks as a pastime, rather than huffing and puffing about this ludicrous notion of millions of pounds being poured into a white elephant of an idea.
Unconvinced, says...
3:02pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Ian Hoolihan wrote:I think you should say what you want to say
Unconvinced wrote:I think you should stop sitting on the fence
THE BRICK wrote: Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!I dont see any 100% success. Where is this 100% success you claim? All I see is the Echo lamely trying to justify its public campaign by spinning more unsubstantiated rumour, another red herring and throwing yet another bone your way. All I see is froth and nonsense. All I see is wishful thinking. All I see is idle speculation. What I dont see, is a proposal. What I dont see, is hard evidence. What I dont see is a business plan. So, an ice rink remains a pipe dream. Pie in the sky. An albatross. A fantasy. A fairy-tale. It aint gonna happen. The economic climate will not support the necessary investment, either in terms of funding the project or in terms of generating solid income from bodies going through the turnstile or buying tickets. You may have more success with tiddleywinks as a pastime, rather than huffing and puffing about this ludicrous notion of millions of pounds being poured into a white elephant of an idea.
Pigeon, stool says...
3:05pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Unconvinced wrote:I think we should start a petition, see how many people would be in favour of a city-wide Sitting Fence.
Ian Hoolihan wrote:I think you should say what you want to say
Unconvinced wrote:I think you should stop sitting on the fence
THE BRICK wrote: Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!I dont see any 100% success. Where is this 100% success you claim? All I see is the Echo lamely trying to justify its public campaign by spinning more unsubstantiated rumour, another red herring and throwing yet another bone your way. All I see is froth and nonsense. All I see is wishful thinking. All I see is idle speculation. What I dont see, is a proposal. What I dont see, is hard evidence. What I dont see is a business plan. So, an ice rink remains a pipe dream. Pie in the sky. An albatross. A fantasy. A fairy-tale. It aint gonna happen. The economic climate will not support the necessary investment, either in terms of funding the project or in terms of generating solid income from bodies going through the turnstile or buying tickets. You may have more success with tiddleywinks as a pastime, rather than huffing and puffing about this ludicrous notion of millions of pounds being poured into a white elephant of an idea.
Unconvinced, says...
3:12pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:Would we get 5,000 signatures or just splinters in the bum?
Unconvinced wrote:I think we should start a petition, see how many people would be in favour of a city-wide Sitting Fence.
Ian Hoolihan wrote:I think you should say what you want to say
Unconvinced wrote:I think you should stop sitting on the fence
THE BRICK wrote: Read this, the USS campaign is a 100% successful, George!!I dont see any 100% success. Where is this 100% success you claim? All I see is the Echo lamely trying to justify its public campaign by spinning more unsubstantiated rumour, another red herring and throwing yet another bone your way. All I see is froth and nonsense. All I see is wishful thinking. All I see is idle speculation. What I dont see, is a proposal. What I dont see, is hard evidence. What I dont see is a business plan. So, an ice rink remains a pipe dream. Pie in the sky. An albatross. A fantasy. A fairy-tale. It aint gonna happen. The economic climate will not support the necessary investment, either in terms of funding the project or in terms of generating solid income from bodies going through the turnstile or buying tickets. You may have more success with tiddleywinks as a pastime, rather than huffing and puffing about this ludicrous notion of millions of pounds being poured into a white elephant of an idea.
Pigeon, stool says...
3:17pm Fri 29 Aug 08
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
hoo flung dung, soton says...
3:18pm Fri 29 Aug 08
you have more chance of the Echo stopping outsourcing UK jobs to oversea's countrys than you have of getting an ice rink!
THE PLANK, says...
3:26pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:Count me in. Where do I sign the petition?
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Pigeon, stool says...
3:32pm Fri 29 Aug 08
THE PLANK wrote:I'll be marching from one end of town to, err, a couple of hundred yards from that end of town tomorrow, with a couple of mates who've nothing better to do and thought it might be a jolly nice outing. Then we'll go for a cup of tea
Pigeon wrote:Count me in. Where do I sign the petition?
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
southy, westy, northy, easty any way the wind blows, says...
3:37pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:Brilliant!
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
You should claim "100% success" for a Sitting Fence being erected in Southampton.
How about a temporary Sitting Fence for the Christmas hols?
Pigeon, stool says...
3:43pm Fri 29 Aug 08
southy, westy, northy, easty any way the wind blows wrote:Studies that I just made up a minute ago show that there are already fifty-nine squillion Sitting Fences in Hampshire alone. Some projected figures based on what I had for lunch suggest that the net annual income for one of these Sitting Fences alone would be greater than the GDP of Brazil. It's not a question of if we get a Sitting Fence, it's a question of when
Pigeon wrote:Brilliant!
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
You should claim "100% success" for a Sitting Fence being erected in Southampton.
How about a temporary Sitting Fence for the Christmas hols?
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Pigeon, stool says...
3:47pm Fri 29 Aug 08
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
THE PLANK, says...
3:48pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:There are plenty of potential sites for a Sitting Fence. Outside the Echo Offices? Outside the Civic Center? Or, the well-publicised site for the dreamy, non-existant ice rink? (But then again that site is a tad hard to locate.)
THE PLANK wrote:I\'ll be marching from one end of town to, err, a couple of hundred yards from that end of town tomorrow, with a couple of mates who\'ve nothing better to do and thought it might be a jolly nice outing. Then we\'ll go for a cup of tea
Pigeon wrote:Count me in. Where do I sign the petition?
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\\\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Pigeon, stool says...
3:52pm Fri 29 Aug 08
THE PLANK wrote:There are over nine thousand possible locations for a Sitting Fence in Southampton. The current plan is to dig a big hole in the middle of Northam, empty all the tower blocks into it, push the rest of the city out half a mile in every direction, half it, double it, add three, take away the number you first thought of, then build it there
Pigeon wrote:There are plenty of potential sites for a Sitting Fence. Outside the Echo Offices? Outside the Civic Center? Or, the well-publicised site for the dreamy, non-existant ice rink? (But then again that site is a tad hard to locate.)
THE PLANK wrote:I\'ll be marching from one end of town to, err, a couple of hundred yards from that end of town tomorrow, with a couple of mates who\'ve nothing better to do and thought it might be a jolly nice outing. Then we\'ll go for a cup of tea
Pigeon wrote:Count me in. Where do I sign the petition?
If we look at how fences in other cities have been utilised for sitting on over the past 20 years, we can get a good idea how popular a Sitting Fence would be. I sat on a fence in the 1984 Olympics, and came second, so I reckon it would be very popular
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\\\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Paramjit Bahia, Southampton says...
3:59pm Fri 29 Aug 08
I shRINK, In the fridge says...
3:59pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon, stool says...
4:00pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Paramjit Bahia wrote:Pah! Don't go polluting our campaign with lousy old "facts" you neggie pooftah!
Those who want to sit on the fence should make sure it hasn't got any splinters or barbered wire! Otherwise they could end up getting splinters up thy a---
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Spokesperson for P.U.F.F.S, says...
4:08pm Fri 29 Aug 08
We have a cute and highly original little slogan:
"Its not if it will happen but when it will happen"
Ian Hoolihan, says...
4:12pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Paramjit Bahia wrote:up what...My arms? Don't tease, what is it?
Those who want to sit on the fence should make sure it hasn't got any splinters or barbered wire! Otherwise they could end up getting splinters up thy a---
THE PLANK, says...
4:17pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:" up thy a--- "
Paramjit Bahia wrote:Pah! Don\'t go polluting our campaign with lousy old \"facts\" you neggie pooftah!
Those who want to sit on the fence should make sure it hasn\'t got any splinters or barbered wire! Otherwise they could end up getting splinters up thy a---
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE\'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
Wonderful!
A convert.
Someone sitting on the fence already! And its not even built yet.
southy, easty, northy, westy any way the wind blows, says...
4:38pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Pigeon wrote:Plank, m8, dont listen to this woody pigeon,your the man, man, If we build a picket fence then we wont be bothred by neggie picets, piceting our jolly nice picket fince
Well, all you girlie neggie pooftahs, you said it wouldn't happen, but I rang up the council today and asked if they'd subsidise a Sitting Fence for Southampton, and they said "look, stop phoning us you dreadful little turd, for the fiftieth time, this isn't the council, it's the West Meon Post Office". So it looks like a 100% success rate for our campaign! In your face, neggas!
GIVE US A SITTING FENCE! AND THEN WE'LL SIT ON THE FENCE!
( remindar to myself: I must lern to spell)
(2nd remindarr to myself: must join librrary and read books on local historikal facts and then new labour will not think am talkin out my a--- )
Gilmore, Shirley, Southampton says...
4:40pm Fri 29 Aug 08
You lot make me laugh :D
THE PLANK, says...
4:49pm Fri 29 Aug 08
Enough said.
Pigeon, stool says...
5:02pm Fri 29 Aug 08
THE PLANK wrote:My next-door-neighbour'
The Council are in possession of highly classified facts about potential developers for a Sitting Fence. I am not at liberty to share this information on a public forum. Why, becasue I am full of self importance. And, another thing. I wilt under rational critiscm. Its simply that I do not have facts to respond to honest criticsm. Intelligent arguments crush me. Its hurtful. So I am going to, head off at the pass, all you neggies or potential neggies who think a Sitting Fence will not happen. I am going into secluded temporary retirment to sulk until the Echo does another brilliant job of ressurecting a dead duck.
Enough said.
s mums cousins auntie's cleaning lady's dog confirmed earlier that CI5 are indeed running covert operations to ascertain whether there might be a terrorist plot to abuse the Sitting Fence to bring about another 9/11 disaster in downtown Northam. Councillors Bodie and Doyle have already proven that skidding a Ford Capri round a corner is only the b
THE BRICK, @THE IC RINK says...
10:48am Fri 29 Aug 08