Why should OAPs have free bus travel - the big debate (From Daily Echo)

It is the pensioners’ that keep the bus routes open. Every time we use our bus pass they don't get paid for the distance we travel they charge the maximum fare and make a mint in the process even if we get off after a few stops. People forget that the bus in no longer a public service run for the benefit of the community as a whole but a private company run for profit and for the benefit of a few shareholders. They have NO INTEREST in helping the community and if bus passes are stopped everybody will suffer and end up paying more money for an even worse service.

It's always funny to read the short sighted replies which boil down to 'I can't have it so why should they' which are made without realising that everyone will become a pensioner one day. This could be a ruse to provide a useful argument in years to come based along the line of 'I remember when pensioners got free buss rides so now I'm a pensioner why don't I get them?'

Theres been so much bandied about regarding this. A few years ago pensioners or bus pass holders were paying a token fee to travel (I think it was 20p). Why not reintroduce a similar fare? Makes sense to me. I'm sure bus pass holders wouldn't object. Theres loads of options.

Oh and ps. To the Bluestar bus driver that went 'flying' through a red light at Busledon road/Bath road on Friday at about 2-35pm........ you're an IDIOT!! Your also lucky I didn't get your number as I would have reported you for DANGEROUS driving! I hope your company sees this and finds you and seriously reprimands or fires you!

bazzeroz wrote:
Oh and ps. To the Bluestar bus driver that went 'flying' through a red light at Busledon road/Bath road on Friday at about 2-35pm........ you're an IDIOT!! Your also lucky I didn't get your number as I would have reported you for DANGEROUS driving! I hope your company sees this and finds you and seriously reprimands or fires you!

why don't you contact the buys company,
they will know who was driving that bus at that time, you do not need a number.

Hercules Grytpype-Thynne wrote:
We should just bump all these old people off. They are non productive, cost us a great deal of money and are always moaning. If we got shot of them all it would free up a lot of housing and hospital beds and we wouldn't have to waste money on nursing or care homes. The govt should also take all their savings from them and use it to creat jobs for young people. It would be easy to get rid of them as all we need to do is to stop their fuel allownce and let them freeze to death this winter. Old people are just a bloody nuisance.

This notion will become even more attractive to you as you open your 'Happy 65th' birthday card while listening for the knock on the door. Congratulations on winning the prize for the most short sighted post.

As pensioners travel outside of the rush hour, they are only filling up the empty seats. When the buses were owned by the City, and not some private company, the services were better and the buses were full up with happy passengers. In the last two years, there have been cuts to services and even routes taken out as not being profitable. For the sake of a few thousand pounds, the Council sold off the buses to First Bus just to keep the budget down. Parmi Bahia should know this as he was a driver at the same time as me.

Hercules Grytpype-Thynne wrote:
We should just bump all these old people off. They are non productive, cost us a great deal of money and are always moaning. If we got shot of them all it would free up a lot of housing and hospital beds and we wouldn't have to waste money on nursing or care homes. The govt should also take all their savings from them and use it to creat jobs for young people. It would be easy to get rid of them as all we need to do is to stop their fuel allownce and let them freeze to death this winter. Old people are just a bloody nuisance.

Wonderful tongue in cheek stuff, but not far from the truth in some people's minds. But why stop there? Why not get rid of all members of the population who are deemed to be unproductive and cost money to maintain? The sick, the jobless, the criminal element, etc. etc.

This is a repeat of what I have said under the other headline.

Why is there the need to have three separate headlines for discussion on this subject? Methinks the Echo is trying to drum up enough anti-pensioner and anti-bus pass emotion so that certain Councillors can use it as "evidence" when the pass subsidy is officiallly discussed.
The only people making anything from the pass are the bus companies who receive the subsidy. If passes did not exist, the buses would be empty outside rush hours and therefore profitless, and so services would be cut even further, and fares go up for the rest.”

Ok lets be fair about it, scrap senior citizens concesionary passes but scrap All concesionary passes also, what is good for one is good for all.

In Hampshire alone, people with bus passes or travel vouchers, made more than 12 million journeys last year.

That could have been 12 million car journeys. so why are bus pass users being seen as scroungers instead of in a positive way, as in helping the environment with their low carbon footprint?.

http://www.transport
direct.info/Web2/Jou
rneyPlanning/Journey
EmissionsCompare.asp
x?repeatingloop=Y

Like most arguments, it all depends on the spin that's put on it.

OK, I thought the '£18M subsidy' sounded a bit much. So, I checked the subsidy reimbursement payments to bus companies that HCC are making. This info is freely available on their website. I totalled an amount around £4M for the last 12-months. So, can someone explain where the other £14M comes from please? Or is this just 'smoke and mirrors' to push-through a cost saving exercise?

Fact: without this subsidy many of these bus services would not exist.

bazzeroz wrote:
Oh and ps. To the Bluestar bus driver that went 'flying' through a red light at Busledon road/Bath road on Friday at about 2-35pm........ you're an IDIOT!! Your also lucky I didn't get your number as I would have reported you for DANGEROUS driving! I hope your company sees this and finds you and seriously reprimands or fires you!

So you haven't told the bus company about this but you come on to a newspaper forum to tell everyone else?

What a sad and lonely person you must be.............or more likely it didn't happen in the first place.

roofspace wrote:
It is the pensioners’ that keep the bus routes open. Every time we use our bus pass they don't get paid for the distance we travel they charge the maximum fare and make a mint in the process even if we get off after a few stops. People forget that the bus in no longer a public service run for the benefit of the community as a whole but a private company run for profit and for the benefit of a few shareholders. They have NO INTEREST in helping the community and if bus passes are stopped everybody will suffer and end up paying more money for an even worse service.

Sorry it's the pensioners who forced the increase to normal fare payers & driven them off the busses.
My friend could have a bus pass but he has a car.
he thinks it's crazy that people who can afford to pay for the fares are riding busses for free at every one else's expense some of which are far worse off than them.
we agree pensioners on basic state pension should travel free but many are not!

Northamboy wrote:

bazzeroz wrote:
Oh and ps. To the Bluestar bus driver that went 'flying' through a red light at Busledon road/Bath road on Friday at about 2-35pm........ you're an IDIOT!! Your also lucky I didn't get your number as I would have reported you for DANGEROUS driving! I hope your company sees this and finds you and seriously reprimands or fires you!

So you haven't told the bus company about this but you come on to a newspaper forum to tell everyone else?

What a sad and lonely person you must be.............or more likely it didn't happen in the first place.

I think you are a antagonizing p.rick and probably a bus driver so go jump a red light!

Physoc wrote:
OK, I thought the '£18M subsidy' sounded a bit much. So, I checked the subsidy reimbursement payments to bus companies that HCC are making. This info is freely available on their website. I totalled an amount around £4M for the last 12-months. So, can someone explain where the other £14M comes from please? Or is this just 'smoke and mirrors' to push-through a cost saving exercise?

Fact: without this subsidy many of these bus services would not exist.

Typical MONTHLY payments listed under "Spending Area" as Concessionary Fares Issuing and "Expense Type" as Concessionary Fares - Regular Payments" total:

First £551,000
Stagecoach £703,000
GoAhead Group £173,00

In total that's just about £1.4m per month. Multiplying by 12 gives £17.14m for the year. I haven't bothered to add up the small operators' payments eg, Velvet, Brijan, Xelabus etc which will undoubtedly bring this figure up to around £18m.

My figures are taken from HCC's Payments to Suppliers data which "Pending clarification from Government, payments from schools delegated budgets are not included at this stage, otherwise all relevant payments of £500 or more, net of VAT, not relating to remuneration (e.g. salaries), are listed.

soton_resident wrote:

Physoc wrote:
OK, I thought the '£18M subsidy' sounded a bit much. So, I checked the subsidy reimbursement payments to bus companies that HCC are making. This info is freely available on their website. I totalled an amount around £4M for the last 12-months. So, can someone explain where the other £14M comes from please? Or is this just 'smoke and mirrors' to push-through a cost saving exercise?

Fact: without this subsidy many of these bus services would not exist.

Typical MONTHLY payments listed under "Spending Area" as Concessionary Fares Issuing and "Expense Type" as Concessionary Fares - Regular Payments" total:

First £551,000
Stagecoach £703,000
GoAhead Group £173,00

In total that's just about £1.4m per month. Multiplying by 12 gives £17.14m for the year. I haven't bothered to add up the small operators' payments eg, Velvet, Brijan, Xelabus etc which will undoubtedly bring this figure up to around £18m.

My figures are taken from HCC's Payments to Suppliers data which "Pending clarification from Government, payments from schools delegated budgets are not included at this stage, otherwise all relevant payments of £500 or more, net of VAT, not relating to remuneration (e.g. salaries), are listed.

Hi Soton Resident. Yes, that's the trouble with taking just one statistic and applying it broadly. If you look at, for example, the figures for April 2012 the total for ALL concessionary bus services in Hampshire, including the small Dial-A-Ride and community services, came to £241158. Would you like to extrapolate this figure times twelve to £2.8M a-year?.... No, I thought not.

The fact I would continue to make is, that without a subsidy, wherever it might come from, many bus services would not exist. If the 240,000+ who receive a bus pass paid, say, £10-a-year for the pass and a nominal sum, say 20p a journey, the cost to the County, whatever it is, would be reduced and everyone would still get a bus to travel on....

well i,m a oldie and travel several times a day on various buses,mainly bluestar but depending on what i have to do also stagecoach/velvet,an
d i,ve always said i had a half fare all day pass before the free came in,and the bus companys had a ticket were if you needed to travel a lot in a day you paid for a daily ticket used on most services,i know the pittance the companies get for the passes,and surgested that most could pay maybe 50single/£1 return,not many couldnt afford that,im just on pension and pension credit but i,ve seen how the paying travellers and services have suffered,my only stipulation would be that this applies to all that have passes,no freebies all get their benefits,and only one child free even single parents get allowance, meant for that child a charge of maybe 50p for any pushchair that takes up the room of more than one seat,these days the companies seem to bow down to mums with now enormous,prams that think they have the right to up people from their seat just for even empty prams,most use the bus as a taxi service,and why do so many on benefits get free passes even on the dole/single parents,this country has gone to far in the nanny pampering and it needs to stop,i worked full time for 52yrs so i have paid all my dues,and hate to see so much waste and greed,[the hcc are worse using money on more managers when the actual work is done by the under dog they still have a great life all these managers when many workers have lost their jobs

Bump all the old people off eh perhaps someone might bump you off one day if it wasnt for the elderly fighting in wars you wouldnt be here, elderly people are not a nuisance i think the world of my mum who is elderly, you'll be elderly one day prat

bazzeroz wrote:

Northamboy wrote:

bazzeroz wrote:
Oh and ps. To the Bluestar bus driver that went 'flying' through a red light at Busledon road/Bath road on Friday at about 2-35pm........ you're an IDIOT!! Your also lucky I didn't get your number as I would have reported you for DANGEROUS driving! I hope your company sees this and finds you and seriously reprimands or fires you!

So you haven't told the bus company about this but you come on to a newspaper forum to tell everyone else?

What a sad and lonely person you must be.............or more likely it didn't happen in the first place.

I think you are a antagonizing p.rick and probably a bus driver so go jump a red light!

Yawn!,,

Quite frankly, I see no reason why old people should have any more reason to use the buses for free than anyone else? This is a stupid topic.

Hercules Grytpype-Thynne wrote:
We should just bump all these old people off. They are non productive, cost us a great deal of money and are always moaning. If we got shot of them all it would free up a lot of housing and hospital beds and we wouldn't have to waste money on nursing or care homes. The govt should also take all their savings from them and use it to creat jobs for young people. It would be easy to get rid of them as all we need to do is to stop their fuel allownce and let them freeze to death this winter. Old people are just a bloody nuisance.

Hasn't even got the ***** to post under his/her own name. A goon? Better believe it and treat this with the contempt it deserves.

Hercules Grytpype-Thynne wrote:
We should just bump all these old people off. They are non productive, cost us a great deal of money and are always moaning. If we got shot of them all it would free up a lot of housing and hospital beds and we wouldn't have to waste money on nursing or care homes. The govt should also take all their savings from them and use it to creat jobs for young people. It would be easy to get rid of them as all we need to do is to stop their fuel allownce and let them freeze to death this winter. Old people are just a bloody nuisance.

Hasn't even got the ***** to post under his/her own name. A goon? Better believe it and treat this with the contempt it deserves.
I don't go by own name either but then again, I don't post these kind of insults.