Southampton City Council to reveal hundreds of jobs could go

Daily Echo: Previous job cuts have sparked council protests Previous job cuts have sparked council protests

Today is D-Day for hundreds of council workers in Southampton.

City chiefs were due to tell staff that up to 250 of them are to lose their jobs.

It comes as they reveal a multi-million pound shortfall in their budget for next year.

On top of the job cuts services will be slashed and charges for vital services hiked.

The new redundancies come just months after 200 contract staff at the Civic Centre were told they were facing the axe.

Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership.

Click below for:

Where the axe will fall?

Labour accused of betraying staff

Cuts are result of perfect storm - finance boss

Comments (66)

Please log in to enable comment sorting

8:18am Mon 12 Nov 12

Ferngully says...

Well, what else do you expect from a labour run council ??
Well, what else do you expect from a labour run council ?? Ferngully

8:35am Mon 12 Nov 12

Over the Edge says...

A Labour council being force to react to Tory led coalition cuts in finance.

I didn't expect anything else, regardless of who was in power in Southampton.

This Government is hell bent on enforcing an austerity policy that simply ins't working, not just in Southampton but everywhere.

Before people start it's all the fault of the previous Labour Governments spend spend spend policy they didn't make the rest of Europe skint
A Labour council being force to react to Tory led coalition cuts in finance. I didn't expect anything else, regardless of who was in power in Southampton. This Government is hell bent on enforcing an austerity policy that simply ins't working, not just in Southampton but everywhere. Before people start it's all the fault of the previous Labour Governments spend spend spend policy they didn't make the rest of Europe skint Over the Edge

9:10am Mon 12 Nov 12

huckit P says...

Ah! I see the knee-jerk reaction from the unions is to threaten industrial action. If there is no money there is no money! But when you look around it is not so difficult to see areas where money could be saved. How many times do you see council (and council contract) workers taking life easy? An hourswork and then another couple spent in the van reading the newspaper. And if you try to complain about it you are met with complete apathy. Do all councillors use the bus or even make full use of technology to hold meetings instead of travelling everywhere?
As for the idea of car park charges for evenings - what bright spark thought of that? People will vote with their feet and go elsewhere and that will hurt the already fragile state of many local businesses.
But don't complain too much about possible charges for green waste collection because Eastleigh already charge depending on how many bags you use.
Ah! I see the knee-jerk reaction from the unions is to threaten industrial action. If there is no money there is no money! But when you look around it is not so difficult to see areas where money could be saved. How many times do you see council (and council contract) workers taking life easy? An hourswork and then another couple spent in the van reading the newspaper. And if you try to complain about it you are met with complete apathy. Do all councillors use the bus or even make full use of technology to hold meetings instead of travelling everywhere? As for the idea of car park charges for evenings - what bright spark thought of that? People will vote with their feet and go elsewhere and that will hurt the already fragile state of many local businesses. But don't complain too much about possible charges for green waste collection because Eastleigh already charge depending on how many bags you use. huckit P

9:20am Mon 12 Nov 12

Sotonians_lets_pull_together says...

This is exactly what the Conservatives said would happen if Labour came in.

Why on earth do the unions put their faith in labour prospective councillors, when it should be obvious they are only saying what they want to hear to get elected?

Labour, as usual with unaffordable commitments, which end up costing real people jobs.

Staff would have been much better off with pay freezes and small reductions in order to protect more jobs. Surely after all, that is what a union is all about, everyone sticking up for each other.

It should not be about fighting any cuts at the cost of people's jobs.
This is exactly what the Conservatives said would happen if Labour came in. Why on earth do the unions put their faith in labour prospective councillors, when it should be obvious they are only saying what they want to hear to get elected? Labour, as usual with unaffordable commitments, which end up costing real people jobs. Staff would have been much better off with pay freezes and small reductions in order to protect more jobs. Surely after all, that is what a union is all about, everyone sticking up for each other. It should not be about fighting any cuts at the cost of people's jobs. Sotonians_lets_pull_together

9:21am Mon 12 Nov 12

Sotonians_lets_pull_together says...

Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs.

People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims.

...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone.

It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda.

All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down!
Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs. People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims. ...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone. It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda. All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down! Sotonians_lets_pull_together

9:41am Mon 12 Nov 12

aldermoorboy says...

l thought Labour said no job cuts and no reduced services, if that is so they have lied again to the public and their workers.
Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors.
Williams is a disgrace, we want honest Roy back and the workers should get sensible intelligent union leaders not this current group.
l thought Labour said no job cuts and no reduced services, if that is so they have lied again to the public and their workers. Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors. Williams is a disgrace, we want honest Roy back and the workers should get sensible intelligent union leaders not this current group. aldermoorboy

9:45am Mon 12 Nov 12

News Fanatic says...

Sotonians_lets_pull_
together
wrote:
This is exactly what the Conservatives said would happen if Labour came in.

Why on earth do the unions put their faith in labour prospective councillors, when it should be obvious they are only saying what they want to hear to get elected?

Labour, as usual with unaffordable commitments, which end up costing real people jobs.

Staff would have been much better off with pay freezes and small reductions in order to protect more jobs. Surely after all, that is what a union is all about, everyone sticking up for each other.

It should not be about fighting any cuts at the cost of people's jobs.
Had the Conservatives continued in power, the cuts would have been far greater. If Labour had not settled the dispute with council employees over pay cuts or the Conservatives remained in power, the legal action by the unions would have continued, leaving the council with a potentially massive bill.
[quote][p][bold]Sotonians_lets_pull_ together[/bold] wrote: This is exactly what the Conservatives said would happen if Labour came in. Why on earth do the unions put their faith in labour prospective councillors, when it should be obvious they are only saying what they want to hear to get elected? Labour, as usual with unaffordable commitments, which end up costing real people jobs. Staff would have been much better off with pay freezes and small reductions in order to protect more jobs. Surely after all, that is what a union is all about, everyone sticking up for each other. It should not be about fighting any cuts at the cost of people's jobs.[/p][/quote]Had the Conservatives continued in power, the cuts would have been far greater. If Labour had not settled the dispute with council employees over pay cuts or the Conservatives remained in power, the legal action by the unions would have continued, leaving the council with a potentially massive bill. News Fanatic

10:02am Mon 12 Nov 12

aldermoorboy says...

1/.If the unions thought they would win £12m they would have gone to court.
2/. Labour have wasted money by stopping the link with the IOW, restoring higher paid employees their money while making poorer workers redundant.
The list is endless, Labour are a disgrace as are the union leaders.
Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors.
1/.If the unions thought they would win £12m they would have gone to court. 2/. Labour have wasted money by stopping the link with the IOW, restoring higher paid employees their money while making poorer workers redundant. The list is endless, Labour are a disgrace as are the union leaders. Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors. aldermoorboy

10:16am Mon 12 Nov 12

Subject48 says...

What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government.

If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos.

Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.
What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government. If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos. Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny. Subject48

10:53am Mon 12 Nov 12

misbehaving says...

Subject48 wrote:
What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government.

If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos.

Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.
Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages?
there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact
[quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government. If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos. Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.[/p][/quote]Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages? there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact misbehaving

10:54am Mon 12 Nov 12

misbehaving says...

Subject48 wrote:
What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government.

If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos.

Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.
Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages?
there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact
[quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government. If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos. Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.[/p][/quote]Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages? there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact misbehaving

11:00am Mon 12 Nov 12

The Wrinkled Retainer says...

You have to say that the two leading stories on the Echo website this morning show perfectly the blatant hypocrisy currently being displayed by councillors of all colours. On the one hand they are (quite rightly) berating Ford for making hundreds of people redundant while at the same time making hundreds of people redundant themselves.

Now where did we put that art collection again? They're only in it for the Monet.....
You have to say that the two leading stories on the Echo website this morning show perfectly the blatant hypocrisy currently being displayed by councillors of all colours. On the one hand they are (quite rightly) berating Ford for making hundreds of people redundant while at the same time making hundreds of people redundant themselves. Now where did we put that art collection again? They're only in it for the Monet..... The Wrinkled Retainer

11:02am Mon 12 Nov 12

Paramjit Bahia says...

NuLabour’s local cut crazy leaders and their supporters are trying to fool the workers and the public by simply blaming it on the ConDem Coalition. Because it is not only this ConDem Coalition of most unprincipled politicians that has started to make the life of all local authorities difficult, but central governments under all three parties has been doing it for a long time.

This exercise in immorality that started under Thatcher was not reversed by Blair and Brown led New Labour government when they had the chance. In fact they implemented Conservative agenda even more enthusiastically than Tories under Thatcher could have dared to do.

Sad part is the attitude of Trade Unions leadership, which apart from very few, rather than looking after the interests of their members have mostly towed the line of their Closet Conservative buddies who control Tory Disraeli inspired NuLabour.

Only way to sort this mess out is for grass root members of unions to kick their parasitical dishonest so called leaders out, stop donating millions to finance the NuLabour, which has absolutely nothing to do with The Labour Party that was launched over 100 years ago as political voice of ordinary people and Trade Unions.

This can be done if all the supposedly lefties who are scattered in small groups and spend more time fighting each other get together and those who still believe in good old Labour Values and are torturing their conscience with Milliband led mob join them and start a brand new party based upon real Labour’s socialist values.

Sticking to Southampton, didn’t Dear Leader Cllr, Williams and his merry boys and girls know what the political and financial situation was before they contested last elections when they told us all kind of fibs and promised that they will be much better than those very rightly disliked Tories under the leadership of Cllr. Smith? If the heat was too much in the kitchen why the hell they entered it?

Only Cllrs. Don Thomas and Keith Morrell have stood by those promises, and for that sin they were forced to leave the New Labour Group. In my view they have proved to be the flag bearers of real Labour, we the people should be electing few more like them, all over the country, so that local councils could unite and challenge the central government to demand proper funding for services they provide.

Is that likely to happen? I do not think so. But one thing for sure like the posters on this site, people will keep on moaning.
NuLabour’s local cut crazy leaders and their supporters are trying to fool the workers and the public by simply blaming it on the ConDem Coalition. Because it is not only this ConDem Coalition of most unprincipled politicians that has started to make the life of all local authorities difficult, but central governments under all three parties has been doing it for a long time. This exercise in immorality that started under Thatcher was not reversed by Blair and Brown led New Labour government when they had the chance. In fact they implemented Conservative agenda even more enthusiastically than Tories under Thatcher could have dared to do. Sad part is the attitude of Trade Unions leadership, which apart from very few, rather than looking after the interests of their members have mostly towed the line of their Closet Conservative buddies who control Tory Disraeli inspired NuLabour. Only way to sort this mess out is for grass root members of unions to kick their parasitical dishonest so called leaders out, stop donating millions to finance the NuLabour, which has absolutely nothing to do with The Labour Party that was launched over 100 years ago as political voice of ordinary people and Trade Unions. This can be done if all the supposedly lefties who are scattered in small groups and spend more time fighting each other get together and those who still believe in good old Labour Values and are torturing their conscience with Milliband led mob join them and start a brand new party based upon real Labour’s socialist values. Sticking to Southampton, didn’t Dear Leader Cllr, Williams and his merry boys and girls know what the political and financial situation was before they contested last elections when they told us all kind of fibs and promised that they will be much better than those very rightly disliked Tories under the leadership of Cllr. Smith? If the heat was too much in the kitchen why the hell they entered it? Only Cllrs. Don Thomas and Keith Morrell have stood by those promises, and for that sin they were forced to leave the New Labour Group. In my view they have proved to be the flag bearers of real Labour, we the people should be electing few more like them, all over the country, so that local councils could unite and challenge the central government to demand proper funding for services they provide. Is that likely to happen? I do not think so. But one thing for sure like the posters on this site, people will keep on moaning. Paramjit Bahia

11:26am Mon 12 Nov 12

Cranthorn says...

It makes little difference who's in power now, the fact is there is less money from central government so budgets are down, regardless of local politics. Restructuring has always been on the cards under Tory or Labour control, and re-structuring equals fewer staff (if done correctly / effectively). Scoring of political points by accusing ones opponents of lying is pure party politics and quite boring!! Sit tight and hope the axe doesn't fall your way!!!!
It makes little difference who's in power now, the fact is there is less money from central government so budgets are down, regardless of local politics. Restructuring has always been on the cards under Tory or Labour control, and re-structuring equals fewer staff (if done correctly / effectively). Scoring of political points by accusing ones opponents of lying is pure party politics and quite boring!! Sit tight and hope the axe doesn't fall your way!!!! Cranthorn

11:27am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

"Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership."

Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few.

The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.
"Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership." Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few. The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts. southy

11:31am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

misbehaving wrote:
Subject48 wrote:
What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government.

If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos.

Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.
Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages?
there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact
The fact is the Torys was going to cut jobs on a larger scale and reduce pay, about 100 jobs more than Labour
[quote][p][bold]misbehaving[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: What a load of crap spouted by people on here. It wont matter which idiot runs the council. The cuts will happen regardless. The only thing you are doing is buying into the petty gov farce of a government. If you honestly believe there would be less cuts under conservative leadership I pity your lack of intelligence. Less cuts would go against every single conservative ethos. Honest councillors hahahaaaaa.... Very funny.[/p][/quote]Then why did the tories try to save jobs by cutting wages? there were less cuts with the tories in southampton and thats a fact[/p][/quote]The fact is the Torys was going to cut jobs on a larger scale and reduce pay, about 100 jobs more than Labour southy

11:32am Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
"Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership."

Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few.

The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.
It’s quite obvious that we all need some Trotskyist fiscal magic.

You see, southy’s TUSC outfit have promised us (from their website): -

“Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions.
Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts.
When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts”

Of course, when challenged several times as to how they would actually achieve this, in view of the severe cuts to local government income inflicted by central government, southy could only waffle on about totally irrelevant things that had absolutely nothing to do with answering the question.

But, hey, don’t worry. I’m convinced that by pushing of a few abacus beads around and the money tree coming into fruit at the command of our heroic comrades, economic reality will be permanently suspended and an age of proletariat plenty will be realised.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: "Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership." Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few. The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.[/p][/quote]It’s quite obvious that we all need some Trotskyist fiscal magic. You see, southy’s TUSC outfit have promised us (from their website): - “Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions. Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts. When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts” Of course, when challenged several times as to how they would actually achieve this, in view of the severe cuts to local government income inflicted by central government, southy could only waffle on about totally irrelevant things that had absolutely nothing to do with answering the question. But, hey, don’t worry. I’m convinced that by pushing of a few abacus beads around and the money tree coming into fruit at the command of our heroic comrades, economic reality will be permanently suspended and an age of proletariat plenty will be realised. freefinker

11:32am Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
"Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership."

Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few.

The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.
Warning anyone was an empty gesture, it was inevitable whatever party was elected was going to have to make cuts, so you can't claim any credit there. You take the electorate for being stupid.

Although I realise that your party needs to scrape the barrel for any it can get.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: "Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership." Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few. The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.[/p][/quote]Warning anyone was an empty gesture, it was inevitable whatever party was elected was going to have to make cuts, so you can't claim any credit there. You take the electorate for being stupid. Although I realise that your party needs to scrape the barrel for any it can get. Shoong

11:37am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

Sotonians_lets_pull_
together
wrote:
Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs.

People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims.

...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone.

It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda.

All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down!
What is needed with in Unions is to stand together, and not just in one section in all sections all over the country.
Its Capitalism that is at fault here and its Right wing supporters, Capitalism will filter the wealth and power into the hands of the few and will not share, Right wing Labour is the same as the Torys now and there is very little differences between the two. its been Capitalism that as been throwing the workers under the bus, just so they can have more.
[quote][p][bold]Sotonians_lets_pull_ together[/bold] wrote: Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs. People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims. ...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone. It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda. All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down![/p][/quote]What is needed with in Unions is to stand together, and not just in one section in all sections all over the country. Its Capitalism that is at fault here and its Right wing supporters, Capitalism will filter the wealth and power into the hands of the few and will not share, Right wing Labour is the same as the Torys now and there is very little differences between the two. its been Capitalism that as been throwing the workers under the bus, just so they can have more. southy

11:43am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton). southy

11:49am Mon 12 Nov 12

ohec says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
"Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership."

Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few.

The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.
Warning anyone was an empty gesture, it was inevitable whatever party was elected was going to have to make cuts, so you can't claim any credit there. You take the electorate for being stupid.

Although I realise that your party needs to scrape the barrel for any it can get.
Well it hit the jackpot with southy.
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: "Opposition bosses said the council staff had been “betrayed” by the Labour leadership." Its Capitalism that is a betrayer of people, its only servs a few and makes the many to pay for those few. The TUSC did warn people what would happen if it was a Tory or Labour Council, read the manifest of both partys and there is very little difference, both where going for cuts.[/p][/quote]Warning anyone was an empty gesture, it was inevitable whatever party was elected was going to have to make cuts, so you can't claim any credit there. You take the electorate for being stupid. Although I realise that your party needs to scrape the barrel for any it can get.[/p][/quote]Well it hit the jackpot with southy. ohec

11:49am Mon 12 Nov 12

Sotonians_lets_pull_together says...

News Fanatic: "Had the Conservatives continued in power, the cuts would have been far greater. If Labour had not settled the dispute with council employees over pay cuts or the Conservatives remained in power, the legal action by the unions would have continued, leaving the council with a potentially massive bill."

I dont agree at all. I dont think the legal action would have been successful, and the pay cuts should not have been reversed.

The conservative council made those cuts with the best of intentions, to try to preserve as many jobs as possible, whilst preserving services.

Typical unions and labour, it seems they would rather see redundancies that be responsible for cutting back budgets to sustainable levels via pay restraint.

There should be legislation brought in to bar strikes which are not supported by a simple majority of the all the workers employed by the employer.

The ability to call strikes which are supported only by a thin majority of a tiny fraction of the workforce that vote is completely undemocratic. Any worker that does not cast a vote for a strike or an abstension should be automatically considered to be casting a vote against the strike.

It is vital that the vast majority of workers who know that the left wing dinosaurs are jeopardising their jobs must stand up to these unions and vote down inappropriate strike action.

These workers should be volunteering to take pay reductions to help keep these staff in their jobs. Surely that is what socialism is all about.
News Fanatic: "Had the Conservatives continued in power, the cuts would have been far greater. If Labour had not settled the dispute with council employees over pay cuts or the Conservatives remained in power, the legal action by the unions would have continued, leaving the council with a potentially massive bill." I dont agree at all. I dont think the legal action would have been successful, and the pay cuts should not have been reversed. The conservative council made those cuts with the best of intentions, to try to preserve as many jobs as possible, whilst preserving services. Typical unions and labour, it seems they would rather see redundancies that be responsible for cutting back budgets to sustainable levels via pay restraint. There should be legislation brought in to bar strikes which are not supported by a simple majority of the all the workers employed by the employer. The ability to call strikes which are supported only by a thin majority of a tiny fraction of the workforce that vote is completely undemocratic. Any worker that does not cast a vote for a strike or an abstension should be automatically considered to be casting a vote against the strike. It is vital that the vast majority of workers who know that the left wing dinosaurs are jeopardising their jobs must stand up to these unions and vote down inappropriate strike action. These workers should be volunteering to take pay reductions to help keep these staff in their jobs. Surely that is what socialism is all about. Sotonians_lets_pull_together

11:50am Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Sotonians_lets_pull_

together
wrote:
Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs.

People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims.

...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone.

It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda.

All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down!
What is needed with in Unions is to stand together, and not just in one section in all sections all over the country.
Its Capitalism that is at fault here and its Right wing supporters, Capitalism will filter the wealth and power into the hands of the few and will not share, Right wing Labour is the same as the Torys now and there is very little differences between the two. its been Capitalism that as been throwing the workers under the bus, just so they can have more.
It's the same old tired stuff, day in, day out, lot's of anti-capitalism rhetoric and strange ideas, with no realistic solutions or any real idea of how to implement them.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sotonians_lets_pull_ together[/bold] wrote: Efforts to get rid of the conservative council through strikes and resisting cost savings have cost real people their jobs. People always have to remember that political idealists are too often ready to "throw the workers under bus" to achieve their aims.... ever ready to sacrifice livelihoods of individuals to achieve their political aims. ...people need to remember that left wing ideologies, labour and the unions cost people jobs: ignoring reality helps noone. It is a tragedy that a hard line minority were allowed to set the political agenda. All the workers who do not support strikes need to stand up to the hard liners next time, and vote them down![/p][/quote]What is needed with in Unions is to stand together, and not just in one section in all sections all over the country. Its Capitalism that is at fault here and its Right wing supporters, Capitalism will filter the wealth and power into the hands of the few and will not share, Right wing Labour is the same as the Torys now and there is very little differences between the two. its been Capitalism that as been throwing the workers under the bus, just so they can have more.[/p][/quote]It's the same old tired stuff, day in, day out, lot's of anti-capitalism rhetoric and strange ideas, with no realistic solutions or any real idea of how to implement them. Shoong

11:54am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

“Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions.
Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts.
When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts”

And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it.

Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump.
A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend.
“Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions. Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts. When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts” And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it. Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump. A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend. southy

11:55am Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer. freefinker

11:59am Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you. southy

12:00pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
“Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions.
Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts.
When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts”

And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it.

Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump.
A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend.
Yes, we are all well aware of this. You say it every day.There's nothing actually wrong with it, if that is your mindset.

But what we don't see is any plan or any kind of solutions on how you would achieve that.

*Ideas* are fine! But ideas and theory's need solid plans, facts and not just in the short term, but in the long term, sustainability must be maintained.

If you have none of the above it looks like you are just preying on people's fears and popular opinion just to get yourself into power. Then what? You don't know, because it's a political ploy, not in anyway shape or form to help anyone.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: “Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions. Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts. When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts” And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it. Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump. A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend.[/p][/quote]Yes, we are all well aware of this. You say it every day.There's nothing actually wrong with it, if that is your mindset. But what we don't see is any plan or any kind of solutions on how you would achieve that. *Ideas* are fine! But ideas and theory's need solid plans, facts and not just in the short term, but in the long term, sustainability must be maintained. If you have none of the above it looks like you are just preying on people's fears and popular opinion just to get yourself into power. Then what? You don't know, because it's a political ploy, not in anyway shape or form to help anyone. Shoong

12:08pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year? freefinker

12:14pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
“Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions.
Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts.
When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts”

And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it.

Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump.
A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend.
Yes, we are all well aware of this. You say it every day.There's nothing actually wrong with it, if that is your mindset.

But what we don't see is any plan or any kind of solutions on how you would achieve that.

*Ideas* are fine! But ideas and theory's need solid plans, facts and not just in the short term, but in the long term, sustainability must be maintained.

If you have none of the above it looks like you are just preying on people's fears and popular opinion just to get yourself into power. Then what? You don't know, because it's a political ploy, not in anyway shape or form to help anyone.
The fact is that Cuts, Job losses, Reduction in pay do not work, time have proven this over and over again, That is the nature of Capitalism to repete what it has done before, because it as tired every thing that is Capitalism and none of it works, Capitalism as nothing new to offer only to keep repeting it self, and its only the ordinary people on the streets that lose out.
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: “Oppose all cuts to council jobs, services, pay and conditions. Reject increases in council tax, rent and service charges to compensate for government cuts. When faced with government cuts to council funding, councils should refuse to implement the cuts” And what is wrong with that, it shows that the TUSC is willing to fight the Government for what is right, and not just roll over and do nothing about it. Lost of jobs and/or pay cuts will result in one thing, less money going into the local economy, lest money in the economy means one thing the private sector making bigger cuts so even more money is lost to the economy and causing a deeper slump. A economy only works if people have money to be able to spend.[/p][/quote]Yes, we are all well aware of this. You say it every day.There's nothing actually wrong with it, if that is your mindset. But what we don't see is any plan or any kind of solutions on how you would achieve that. *Ideas* are fine! But ideas and theory's need solid plans, facts and not just in the short term, but in the long term, sustainability must be maintained. If you have none of the above it looks like you are just preying on people's fears and popular opinion just to get yourself into power. Then what? You don't know, because it's a political ploy, not in anyway shape or form to help anyone.[/p][/quote]The fact is that Cuts, Job losses, Reduction in pay do not work, time have proven this over and over again, That is the nature of Capitalism to repete what it has done before, because it as tired every thing that is Capitalism and none of it works, Capitalism as nothing new to offer only to keep repeting it self, and its only the ordinary people on the streets that lose out. southy

12:16pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

aldermoorboy wrote:
1/.If the unions thought they would win £12m they would have gone to court.
2/. Labour have wasted money by stopping the link with the IOW, restoring higher paid employees their money while making poorer workers redundant.
The list is endless, Labour are a disgrace as are the union leaders.
Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors.
Like the two that ignored our pleas to save the Flower Roads community centre and the Swaythling youth centre that they sold off to get cash for the Sea City Mausoleum, and then one of them (we got rid of the other at the last election) had the audacity to berate the Labour lot for planning to get rid of the Oaklands pool previously neglect by the Tories. there was a time when I voted Tory, but it is unlikely that I will again, definately not while they are such an obnoxious self serving bunch.
[quote][p][bold]aldermoorboy[/bold] wrote: 1/.If the unions thought they would win £12m they would have gone to court. 2/. Labour have wasted money by stopping the link with the IOW, restoring higher paid employees their money while making poorer workers redundant. The list is endless, Labour are a disgrace as are the union leaders. Vote Tory in 2014 for honest councillors.[/p][/quote]Like the two that ignored our pleas to save the Flower Roads community centre and the Swaythling youth centre that they sold off to get cash for the Sea City Mausoleum, and then one of them (we got rid of the other at the last election) had the audacity to berate the Labour lot for planning to get rid of the Oaklands pool previously neglect by the Tories. there was a time when I voted Tory, but it is unlikely that I will again, definately not while they are such an obnoxious self serving bunch. Inform Al

12:20pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not. southy

12:29pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it? freefinker

12:38pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how. southy

12:48pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it? freefinker

1:15pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation. southy

1:16pm Mon 12 Nov 12

sarfhamton says...

Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly. sarfhamton

1:18pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
Just about sums it up.

Types a lot - but says nothing.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote]Just about sums it up. Types a lot - but says nothing. Shoong

1:23pm Mon 12 Nov 12

IronLady2010 says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
Do you mean using Council reserves and taking Loans, Southy??

Refuse to implement all the Con-Dem cuts
In the short term, use the Council reserves and loans to fund a budget to meet the needs of the population.
Support the Counihan Campaign, Trade Unions, community groups and the public to build a mass movement against austerity to halt Central Government’s plans to force austerity cuts should the councillors take a fighting stand.
Campaign for Central Government to fully fund a needs-based Council budget. Corporations are sitting on £850 billion and avoid £120 billion in taxes per year, so the money is out there to make austerity history! In the absence of a campaign from Labour, we must stand our own councillors in elections on an anti-cuts basis!

** taken from http://tuscbrent.wor
dpress.com/
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote]Do you mean using Council reserves and taking Loans, Southy?? Refuse to implement all the Con-Dem cuts In the short term, use the Council reserves and loans to fund a budget to meet the needs of the population. Support the Counihan Campaign, Trade Unions, community groups and the public to build a mass movement against austerity to halt Central Government’s plans to force austerity cuts should the councillors take a fighting stand. Campaign for Central Government to fully fund a needs-based Council budget. Corporations are sitting on £850 billion and avoid £120 billion in taxes per year, so the money is out there to make austerity history! In the absence of a campaign from Labour, we must stand our own councillors in elections on an anti-cuts basis! ** taken from http://tuscbrent.wor dpress.com/ IronLady2010

1:30pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it? freefinker

1:57pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

sarfhamton wrote:
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism.
Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.
[quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.[/p][/quote]There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism. Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few. southy

2:13pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Torchie1 says...

southy wrote:
sarfhamton wrote:
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism.
Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.
The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.[/p][/quote]There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism. Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.[/p][/quote]The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism. Torchie1

2:19pm Mon 12 Nov 12

sarfhamton says...

Torchie1 wrote:
southy wrote:
sarfhamton wrote:
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism.
Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.
The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.
We are heading for a third way, basically dictatorship by PLC
[quote][p][bold]Torchie1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.[/p][/quote]There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism. Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.[/p][/quote]The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.[/p][/quote]We are heading for a third way, basically dictatorship by PLC sarfhamton

2:19pm Mon 12 Nov 12

mr nobody says...

I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .
I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour . mr nobody

2:25pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

Torchie1 wrote:
southy wrote:
sarfhamton wrote:
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism.
Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.
The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.
.. and the reason is - it doesn't work.

You only need to see my exchange with southy above to see that the Trotskyists are incapable of providing real answers to real problems.
[quote][p][bold]Torchie1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.[/p][/quote]There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism. Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.[/p][/quote]The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.[/p][/quote].. and the reason is - it doesn't work. You only need to see my exchange with southy above to see that the Trotskyists are incapable of providing real answers to real problems. freefinker

2:30pm Mon 12 Nov 12

FoysCornerBoy says...

Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years.

The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation.

For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector.

I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services.


I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism.
Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years. The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation. For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector. I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services. I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism. FoysCornerBoy

2:33pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first. southy

2:35pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

sarfhamton wrote:
Torchie1 wrote:
southy wrote:
sarfhamton wrote:
Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website.

My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.
There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism.
Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.
The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.
We are heading for a third way, basically dictatorship by PLC
That come under Capitalism.
[quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Torchie1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sarfhamton[/bold] wrote: Socialism and Capitalism are both dead, with its supporters reduced to mud slinging on a local paper website. My thought goes to the workers who will lose their jobs and won't be able to find another one very quickly.[/p][/quote]There is only Capitalism or Socialism / Right and Left. Capitalism don't work and Socialism is not giving the chance to prove it self as a working model, and Socialism will only work when Socialist are in control of it, its not Socialism when Capitalist are incontroll of Socialism like it has been in the pass, we seen what happens to Socialism is incontroll by Capitalist its just turns out to be Capitalism. Socialism is designed for the majority it shares the wealth and power, Capitalism is the opposite it wants to controll and own every thing, its for the few.[/p][/quote]The amazing answer to all of the problems mankind faces but oddly enough no-one will vote for socialism.[/p][/quote]We are heading for a third way, basically dictatorship by PLC[/p][/quote]That come under Capitalism. southy

2:38pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

Torchie1 people vote Labour thinking it is Socialism and do not realise that its is controlled by the Capitalist or they vote Labour because its the lesser of the two evils.
Torchie1 people vote Labour thinking it is Socialism and do not realise that its is controlled by the Capitalist or they vote Labour because its the lesser of the two evils. southy

2:39pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Cyber__Fug says...

FoysCornerBoy wrote:
Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years.

The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation.

For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector.

I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services.


I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism.
This council, like other across the country, is overstaffed. The unfortunate situation is that cuts are often made in the wrong places. So once the staffing levels are stabilised then the money can be distributed back onto the crucial areas.

The rise in council tax won't cure the problem yet.
[quote][p][bold]FoysCornerBoy[/bold] wrote: Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years. The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation. For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector. I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services. I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism.[/p][/quote]This council, like other across the country, is overstaffed. The unfortunate situation is that cuts are often made in the wrong places. So once the staffing levels are stabilised then the money can be distributed back onto the crucial areas. The rise in council tax won't cure the problem yet. Cyber__Fug

2:43pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
.. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search.

And, you still haven't answered the question, have you?

No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.[/p][/quote].. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search. And, you still haven't answered the question, have you? No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out? freefinker

2:45pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

mr nobody wrote:
I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .
Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.
[quote][p][bold]mr nobody[/bold] wrote: I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .[/p][/quote]Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention. southy

2:50pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Cyber__Fug says...

southy wrote:
mr nobody wrote:
I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .
Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.
Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]mr nobody[/bold] wrote: I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .[/p][/quote]Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.[/p][/quote]Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ? Cyber__Fug

2:50pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
.. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search.

And, you still haven't answered the question, have you?

No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?
No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections.
It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.[/p][/quote].. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search. And, you still haven't answered the question, have you? No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?[/p][/quote]No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections. It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few. southy

2:53pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
.. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search.

And, you still haven't answered the question, have you?

No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?
No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections.
It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.
Also Free when you make cuts the money will run out and thats for sure, you start on a program of cuts and you will end up making more and more cuts, its an endless cycle that will all ways loop back on iy self to there is nothing left for any body apart from the wealthy.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.[/p][/quote].. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search. And, you still haven't answered the question, have you? No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?[/p][/quote]No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections. It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.[/p][/quote]Also Free when you make cuts the money will run out and thats for sure, you start on a program of cuts and you will end up making more and more cuts, its an endless cycle that will all ways loop back on iy self to there is nothing left for any body apart from the wealthy. southy

2:57pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
.. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search.

And, you still haven't answered the question, have you?

No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?
No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections.
It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.
.. are, I see.

It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website.

Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.[/p][/quote].. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search. And, you still haven't answered the question, have you? No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?[/p][/quote]No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections. It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.[/p][/quote].. are, I see. It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website. Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is? freefinker

2:57pm Mon 12 Nov 12

aldermoorboy says...

Standard of living up 300% in the last 50 years for all under capitalist system in the UK. I am pleased to live here.
Profit is good for all.
Standard of living up 300% in the last 50 years for all under capitalist system in the UK. I am pleased to live here. Profit is good for all. aldermoorboy

3:00pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

Cyber__Fug wrote:
southy wrote:
mr nobody wrote:
I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .
Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.
Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ?
one or two Capitalist ideal Cyber, like the state nationalise industary where the profits are put back into the country so all will gain from it.
I am that bittered and twisted that if I want to buy a left wing newspaper from the shops I will have to order it, because of the suppliers will not delever true left wing news papers, and they will have to be speically delevered to the shops, and your corporation stores like Tesco will not sale any left wing news papers, even if you speically delever to them.
[quote][p][bold]Cyber__Fug[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]mr nobody[/bold] wrote: I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .[/p][/quote]Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.[/p][/quote]Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ?[/p][/quote]one or two Capitalist ideal Cyber, like the state nationalise industary where the profits are put back into the country so all will gain from it. I am that bittered and twisted that if I want to buy a left wing newspaper from the shops I will have to order it, because of the suppliers will not delever true left wing news papers, and they will have to be speically delevered to the shops, and your corporation stores like Tesco will not sale any left wing news papers, even if you speically delever to them. southy

3:04pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker wrote:
southy wrote:
freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it.
It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).
.. but you still refuse to actually answer the question.

How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically?

Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.
Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.
.. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it?

We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government.

So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income?

How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?
The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them.
Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.
.. so, how the pay the teachers?

All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?
the needs buget program thats how.
.. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books?

Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year.

How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?
Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is.
If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works.
And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.
.. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase.

You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out.

And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year.

You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?
no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping.
And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it.
Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time.
But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.
.. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search.

And, you still haven't answered the question, have you?

No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?
No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections.
It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.
Hmm, just did a Google search for 'Needs Budget Program', no hits, I just got a load of offers for software to sort out my personal finances, rather amusingly.

So all this is down the central library but not on the Internet?

I suggest getting with the 21st Century if you want to promote this.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: freefinker there is a way to fight the government and its only the real Left willing to do it. It was a shame that the Green Party decided to go and implent the cuts in Brighton (I had high hopes for the Greens in Brighton, but they went and let the people down, and was the reason why they did not win that by-election in Brighton).[/p][/quote].. but you still refuse to actually answer the question. How will you provide "No Cuts" whatsoever when income IS being cut dramatically? Waffle does not provide the answer. And that's all you seem to have to offer.[/p][/quote]Read the manifest in full, You know what a Needs Budget Program is dont you.[/p][/quote].. but that STILL doesn't answer the immediate dilemma, does it? We are where we are. Local government income IS being cut by central government. So, how would TUSC square the circle, RIGHT NOW, of "No Cuts" on a much reduced income? How will you pay teachers, refuse collectors, etc. when the cash runs out well before the end of the financial year?[/p][/quote]The needs Budget Program, and at the same time fight Government to get more out of them. Its no good just implenting the Cuts that Government is forcing on Councils, you got to fight back, if you don't fight back it will never change, and all you get is more and more cuts aim at you, this is one of the things that makes the TUSC diferent from the Labour, Torys and now the Greens, the TUSC is willing to make that stand against Government, where as the other will not.[/p][/quote].. so, how the pay the teachers? All good fighting talk, but utterly useless. It WON'T pay the bills, will it?[/p][/quote]the needs buget program thats how.[/p][/quote].. and, perhaps you can tell us how the "needs buget program" will be able to balance the books? Remember, it's definitely "No Cuts" whatsoever, AND less income year on year. How does this magic work? You still haven’t explained. Coming up with the phrase "needs buget program" is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]Have you got 6mths to a year spare to learn what a needs budget program is. If you under stand any thing about politics then you will know what a need budget program is and how it works. And yes a Needs Budget Program is an explanation.[/p][/quote].. no it's not. It's a 3 word phrase. You still haven't explained how you will pay the teachers when the money runs out. And run out it will. As I keep pointing out a "No Cuts" whatsoever policy with a dramatically declining income only has one outcome - you run out of money before the end of the financial year. You have still to explain how you will resolve this fiscal dilemma. Inventing a new phrase and then telling us all it will take 6 months to understand it is NOT an explanation, is it?[/p][/quote]no its a program its a need budget, its not a new phrase, its 3 words that mean some some thing, a way things can be done in an allternative way, a way that favours the majority and not the few, its design to keep the economy rolling and not come to a stand still or slumping. And unlike you i had a number of years reading and looking at the needs budget program where i have not had to digest it all at once, with you if you want to learn and digest what a needs program is then your going to need a lot of time on your hands to learn about it. Its like a resource economics and political policy (that is socialism by the way), it is some thing you can not learn over night it takes a lot of time. But the raw basics of a needs program is that it puts the needs of the people first.[/p][/quote].. no southy, it's a phrase you have just made up. It gets no hits at all when doing a search. And, you still haven't answered the question, have you? No cuts and a declining income are incompatible. Who pays the teaches when the money runs out?[/p][/quote]No your are totally wrong again free. try reading the manifest down in the central Library, for the last 3 elctions at lest, and you will see the words a Needs Budget Program in the last 3 elections. It is not a made up phrase it is some thing thats been around since the 1920's, and they would not try it then as they will not try it now, because it go's against a program of cuts, and shows an allternative way to do things where the majority will benefit and not the few.[/p][/quote]Hmm, just did a Google search for 'Needs Budget Program', no hits, I just got a load of offers for software to sort out my personal finances, rather amusingly. So all this is down the central library but not on the Internet? I suggest getting with the 21st Century if you want to promote this. Shoong

3:06pm Mon 12 Nov 12

FoysCornerBoy says...

Cyber__Fug wrote:
FoysCornerBoy wrote:
Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years.

The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation.

For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector.

I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services.


I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism.
This council, like other across the country, is overstaffed. The unfortunate situation is that cuts are often made in the wrong places. So once the staffing levels are stabilised then the money can be distributed back onto the crucial areas.

The rise in council tax won't cure the problem yet.
You may be right. I'd be interested in exactly how you think Southampton Council is overstaffed and in which areas. Are there too many frontline street cleaners, youth workers and care assistants for example? Or might the Council be more productive with fewer accountants, lawyers and press officers?

I was talking to a Councillor from an inner London borough last week and he described how massive cutbacks in key services 10 years ago were a major factor in the 2011 summer riots which is costing the taxpayer and businesses an absolute fortune in terms of increased expenditure on criminal justice. I really hope Southampton doesn't go down this path
[quote][p][bold]Cyber__Fug[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FoysCornerBoy[/bold] wrote: Having looked at the figures more closely it seems as if one way for the Council to avoid making staff redundant might be to uplift Council tax in line with inflation for the past three years. The major obstacle here, though, is central government in the form of pin-up Eric Pickles. Contrary to its stated commitment to 'localism' the coalition government penalises Councils that seek to offset cuts in jobs and services by raising money through a modest increase in local taxation. For instance Eric Pickles will deny Southampton's citizens £2m of central government grant should Councillors raise Council tax above 1%. This money (which will otherwise sit in Whitehall coffers) should be returned to Southampton to reduce the impact of further public sector job losses on top of those already planned by the private sector. I think the majority of local people would accept a small increase in their Council tax if they could be sure that the money was used to protect vital jobs and services. I look forward to reading the views of those opposed to any Council tax increase in Southampton - an interesting alliance, no doubt, between TUSC supporters and various shades of conservatism.[/p][/quote]This council, like other across the country, is overstaffed. The unfortunate situation is that cuts are often made in the wrong places. So once the staffing levels are stabilised then the money can be distributed back onto the crucial areas. The rise in council tax won't cure the problem yet.[/p][/quote]You may be right. I'd be interested in exactly how you think Southampton Council is overstaffed and in which areas. Are there too many frontline street cleaners, youth workers and care assistants for example? Or might the Council be more productive with fewer accountants, lawyers and press officers? I was talking to a Councillor from an inner London borough last week and he described how massive cutbacks in key services 10 years ago were a major factor in the 2011 summer riots which is costing the taxpayer and businesses an absolute fortune in terms of increased expenditure on criminal justice. I really hope Southampton doesn't go down this path FoysCornerBoy

3:09pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Cyber__Fug wrote:
southy wrote:
mr nobody wrote:
I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .
Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.
Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ?
one or two Capitalist ideal Cyber, like the state nationalise industary where the profits are put back into the country so all will gain from it.
I am that bittered and twisted that if I want to buy a left wing newspaper from the shops I will have to order it, because of the suppliers will not delever true left wing news papers, and they will have to be speically delevered to the shops, and your corporation stores like Tesco will not sale any left wing news papers, even if you speically delever to them.
Yes, that's because no-one buys them in relative terms to other publications off the shelves.

What would be the point in buying them in bulk if they just sit there taking up room for papers that actually sell..?

I can only imagine also that you're not actually thinking of newspapers as the rest of us would know it, but Lefty propaganda with loony headlines in big red letters.

They just don't sell.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cyber__Fug[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]mr nobody[/bold] wrote: I cant believe that the echo have taken my letter off here i put on what had happened to good old freedom of speech or is it that the echo back labour .[/p][/quote]Did you go against the grain, the news media will only support political partys that have more than 20% of the vote, to post on here is easy but to get a letter publish is hard if it go's against the Capitalist strangle hold over the press, they do not want any thing that is really left wing to get any from of attention.[/p][/quote]Bitter, twisted and deluded eh Southy...... do you agree with ANY "Capitalist" ideals ?[/p][/quote]one or two Capitalist ideal Cyber, like the state nationalise industary where the profits are put back into the country so all will gain from it. I am that bittered and twisted that if I want to buy a left wing newspaper from the shops I will have to order it, because of the suppliers will not delever true left wing news papers, and they will have to be speically delevered to the shops, and your corporation stores like Tesco will not sale any left wing news papers, even if you speically delever to them.[/p][/quote]Yes, that's because no-one buys them in relative terms to other publications off the shelves. What would be the point in buying them in bulk if they just sit there taking up room for papers that actually sell..? I can only imagine also that you're not actually thinking of newspapers as the rest of us would know it, but Lefty propaganda with loony headlines in big red letters. They just don't sell. Shoong

3:11pm Mon 12 Nov 12

southy says...

.. are, I see.

freefinker said
It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website.

Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is?

All I can say to you try reading the right web sites and you will see it posted up, the needs budget program as been posted on the TUSC and the Socialist web site for the last 3 to 4 years. To many sites are put up by people not in the know or put sites up to give an image that is false, and then people like you come along reads it and post it up, thinking it must be true because it on a web site, and like I proved the other day when hulla posted a link up, I proved it had nothing to do with the people concern, as I did all ready know those people do noy have an official web site, they do not even let the media into there meetings, because this right wing group do not want the public to know what they really up to.
So stop trying to twist and turn go to the Library and read it from a refence book.
.. are, I see. freefinker said It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website. Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is? All I can say to you try reading the right web sites and you will see it posted up, the needs budget program as been posted on the TUSC and the Socialist web site for the last 3 to 4 years. To many sites are put up by people not in the know or put sites up to give an image that is false, and then people like you come along reads it and post it up, thinking it must be true because it on a web site, and like I proved the other day when hulla posted a link up, I proved it had nothing to do with the people concern, as I did all ready know those people do noy have an official web site, they do not even let the media into there meetings, because this right wing group do not want the public to know what they really up to. So stop trying to twist and turn go to the Library and read it from a refence book. southy

3:12pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Over the Edge says...

The facts are this, since the election last summer the amount of Government cuts inflicted on SCC by Eric Pickles has increased, Royston would have found it impossible to keep his election promises given the extra cuts imposed, funnily enough Eric Pickles he has not increased the amount cuts imposed on Eastleigh BC, Hampshire CC or East Dorset councils, in fact he increased the amount available to spend in East Dorset, one wonders why, a cynical person would say it's because they're Tory and Lib Dem controlled councils.
The facts are this, since the election last summer the amount of Government cuts inflicted on SCC by Eric Pickles has increased, Royston would have found it impossible to keep his election promises given the extra cuts imposed, funnily enough Eric Pickles he has not increased the amount cuts imposed on Eastleigh BC, Hampshire CC or East Dorset councils, in fact he increased the amount available to spend in East Dorset, one wonders why, a cynical person would say it's because they're Tory and Lib Dem controlled councils. Over the Edge

3:37pm Mon 12 Nov 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
.. are, I see.

freefinker said
It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website.

Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is?

All I can say to you try reading the right web sites and you will see it posted up, the needs budget program as been posted on the TUSC and the Socialist web site for the last 3 to 4 years. To many sites are put up by people not in the know or put sites up to give an image that is false, and then people like you come along reads it and post it up, thinking it must be true because it on a web site, and like I proved the other day when hulla posted a link up, I proved it had nothing to do with the people concern, as I did all ready know those people do noy have an official web site, they do not even let the media into there meetings, because this right wing group do not want the public to know what they really up to.
So stop trying to twist and turn go to the Library and read it from a refence book.
.. funny then that all searches fail to find any such reference from either site.

Perhaps you could point us to a few selected pages from either site. You know, just a URL or two will do.

And, oh dear. I think if you return to the Bilderberg thread you accusation that the Bilderberg official website was nothing to do with them was well and truly debugged. You got it totally wrong because you failed to understand the information you posted.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: .. are, I see. freefinker said It's those evil hackers again. Been through the entire internet to make sure every single reference to 'Needs Budget Program' has been entirely deleted. And all just to prove southy wrong on an insignificant local rag website. Anyway, I digress. And the answer to who pays the teachers when the money runs out is? All I can say to you try reading the right web sites and you will see it posted up, the needs budget program as been posted on the TUSC and the Socialist web site for the last 3 to 4 years. To many sites are put up by people not in the know or put sites up to give an image that is false, and then people like you come along reads it and post it up, thinking it must be true because it on a web site, and like I proved the other day when hulla posted a link up, I proved it had nothing to do with the people concern, as I did all ready know those people do noy have an official web site, they do not even let the media into there meetings, because this right wing group do not want the public to know what they really up to. So stop trying to twist and turn go to the Library and read it from a refence book.[/p][/quote].. funny then that all searches fail to find any such reference from either site. Perhaps you could point us to a few selected pages from either site. You know, just a URL or two will do. And, oh dear. I think if you return to the Bilderberg thread you accusation that the Bilderberg official website was nothing to do with them was well and truly debugged. You got it totally wrong because you failed to understand the information you posted. freefinker

6:17pm Mon 12 Nov 12

Torchie1 says...

southy wrote:
Torchie1 people vote Labour thinking it is Socialism and do not realise that its is controlled by the Capitalist or they vote Labour because its the lesser of the two evils.
People are so confused that they vote for one party thinking it will do lots of things that it hasn't mentioned in its manifesto? Your failure to attract votes isn't really your fault then, it's because everyone else is stupid? A new view on your lack of appeal to the electorate but if it gives you a warm fuzzy feeling, who am I to put you right.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Torchie1 people vote Labour thinking it is Socialism and do not realise that its is controlled by the Capitalist or they vote Labour because its the lesser of the two evils.[/p][/quote]People are so confused that they vote for one party thinking it will do lots of things that it hasn't mentioned in its manifesto? Your failure to attract votes isn't really your fault then, it's because everyone else is stupid? A new view on your lack of appeal to the electorate but if it gives you a warm fuzzy feeling, who am I to put you right. Torchie1

5:00pm Tue 13 Nov 12

mickey01 says...

you lot have got what you deserve !
if you had taken the pay cut like normall ungreedy workers then maybe the staffing levels would still be the same
but then again what else do you expect from the labour party
you lot have got what you deserve ! if you had taken the pay cut like normall ungreedy workers then maybe the staffing levels would still be the same but then again what else do you expect from the labour party mickey01

9:33pm Tue 13 Nov 12

bobbyboy says...

Oh dear Oh dear Oh DEAR you've been Bollo-ed again serves you right you didnt listen you went on strike you followed like sheep and now your heading for the knackers yard and we will pick up the bill for you thanks for nothing.
Oh dear Oh dear Oh DEAR you've been Bollo-ed again serves you right you didnt listen you went on strike you followed like sheep and now your heading for the knackers yard and we will pick up the bill for you thanks for nothing. bobbyboy

Comments are closed on this article.

click2find

About cookies

We want you to enjoy your visit to our website. That's why we use cookies to enhance your experience. By staying on our website you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more about the cookies we use.

I agree