Anti social behaviour police uncover cannabis factory

Daily Echo: Anti social behaviour police uncover cannabis factory Anti social behaviour police uncover cannabis factory

POLICE swooped on a town centre home after a tip off about anti-social behaviour - only to find a cannabis factory inside.

Officers were initially called to a flat in Eastleigh High Street at noon on Monday - but when the door opened, they were met with a strong smell of cannabis.

A 33-year-old Eastleigh man was arrested on suspicion of possession of cannabis and production of cannabis.

He has been bailed pending further enquiries to return to Southampton Central station on January 2, 2013.

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7:13pm Tue 13 Nov 12

cantthinkofone says...

Washington State and Colorado have stopped wasting resources on this. Only a matter of time until common sense prevails here hopefully.
Washington State and Colorado have stopped wasting resources on this. Only a matter of time until common sense prevails here hopefully. cantthinkofone

8:47pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Babs Stanley says...

Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly. Babs Stanley

9:22pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
[quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs. Inform Al

9:39pm Tue 13 Nov 12

SuperSilverSourDiesel says...

Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument. SuperSilverSourDiesel

10:19pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

The law against cannabis is immoral in principle and unworkable in practice.
The law against cannabis is immoral in principle and unworkable in practice. Alan-_Hobday

11:04pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

SuperSilverSourDiese
l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
[quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies. Inform Al

11:39pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese

l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Can't you see that it is prohibition that gives these people free reign to a huge market. The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?

It has been proven in studies undertaken by GW Pharmaceuticals that cannabis does NOT cause psychosis. They needed to provide this evidence before they were allowed to grow large quantities of Skunk No1 and Ruderalis cannabis to make their Sativex medicine, which is a 50/50 mix of both. This medicine is now supplied to large numbers of patients, who are NOT going mad as a result of taking it.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Can't you see that it is prohibition that gives these people free reign to a huge market. The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy? It has been proven in studies undertaken by GW Pharmaceuticals that cannabis does NOT cause psychosis. They needed to provide this evidence before they were allowed to grow large quantities of Skunk No1 and Ruderalis cannabis to make their Sativex medicine, which is a 50/50 mix of both. This medicine is now supplied to large numbers of patients, who are NOT going mad as a result of taking it. Alan-_Hobday

11:47pm Tue 13 Nov 12

SimonSomeone says...

I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly. SimonSomeone

11:57pm Tue 13 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Alan-_Hobday wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese


l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Can't you see that it is prohibition that gives these people free reign to a huge market. The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?

It has been proven in studies undertaken by GW Pharmaceuticals that cannabis does NOT cause psychosis. They needed to provide this evidence before they were allowed to grow large quantities of Skunk No1 and Ruderalis cannabis to make their Sativex medicine, which is a 50/50 mix of both. This medicine is now supplied to large numbers of patients, who are NOT going mad as a result of taking it.
The latest research, not undertaken by users, shows clearly that the drug does cause permanent psychosis. I can only assume that you too are a user as dealers will not want the drug legalised and only pathetic users have an interest in it's legalisation. Heroin is also used pharmacutically, perhaps we should legalise that too numbty.
[quote][p][bold]Alan-_Hobday[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Can't you see that it is prohibition that gives these people free reign to a huge market. The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy? It has been proven in studies undertaken by GW Pharmaceuticals that cannabis does NOT cause psychosis. They needed to provide this evidence before they were allowed to grow large quantities of Skunk No1 and Ruderalis cannabis to make their Sativex medicine, which is a 50/50 mix of both. This medicine is now supplied to large numbers of patients, who are NOT going mad as a result of taking it.[/p][/quote]The latest research, not undertaken by users, shows clearly that the drug does cause permanent psychosis. I can only assume that you too are a user as dealers will not want the drug legalised and only pathetic users have an interest in it's legalisation. Heroin is also used pharmacutically, perhaps we should legalise that too numbty. Inform Al

12:02am Wed 14 Nov 12

SimonSomeone says...

"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand? SimonSomeone

12:06am Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

SimonSomeone wrote:
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?
[quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: "The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?[/p][/quote]Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you? Inform Al

12:19am Wed 14 Nov 12

SimonSomeone says...

Inform Al wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?
Sorry, you might be a little addled :) I was replying to a comment a little further up. Mine's the second paragraph.

This is the first time I've felt the need to do this kind of thing and not yet used to the commenting bit. The reason I care is that I have, or more precisely had, a very good friend whose mind is all screwed up thanks to this happy, all loved up treat of a drug (you might sense a little sarcasm in my tone).
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: "The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?[/p][/quote]Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?[/p][/quote]Sorry, you might be a little addled :) I was replying to a comment a little further up. Mine's the second paragraph. This is the first time I've felt the need to do this kind of thing and not yet used to the commenting bit. The reason I care is that I have, or more precisely had, a very good friend whose mind is all screwed up thanks to this happy, all loved up treat of a drug (you might sense a little sarcasm in my tone). SimonSomeone

12:28am Wed 14 Nov 12

SuperSilverSourDiesel says...

SimonSomeone wrote:
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges.

Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself.

http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2
7w

The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia.

''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate''

Like i said, educate yourself

Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'.

So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true...

...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
[quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting. SuperSilverSourDiesel

12:32am Wed 14 Nov 12

SuperSilverSourDiesel says...

Inform Al wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?
NONSENSE.

'''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health'''

Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense.

There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example.

In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects?

Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm.

“Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: "The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?[/p][/quote]Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?[/p][/quote]NONSENSE. '''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health''' Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense. There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example. In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects? Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm. “Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs SuperSilverSourDiesel

3:35am Wed 14 Nov 12

saintinpattaya says...

Informed Al is ill informed. You write sensationalist drivel. I am an engineer who smoked cannabis for over 15 years and my brain functions haven't suffered at all. I have more tolerance now of idiots like yourself that deny adults doing what they want to do in a victimless crime. Taliban production of heroin has increased. Only since the ccountry was overrun by ours and others military. Before that the farmers grew cannabis. Now up to 95% of western use of heroin comes from there. Fact. Another fact is no one in the history of mankind died from cannabis use...ever!!! Non toxic unlike tobacco.more toxins in tea and coffee. I do not use any more but freedom to use would "clean" the business up. And maybe remove the criminal element from being involved due to high profit margins.
Informed Al is ill informed. You write sensationalist drivel. I am an engineer who smoked cannabis for over 15 years and my brain functions haven't suffered at all. I have more tolerance now of idiots like yourself that deny adults doing what they want to do in a victimless crime. Taliban production of heroin has increased. Only since the ccountry was overrun by ours and others military. Before that the farmers grew cannabis. Now up to 95% of western use of heroin comes from there. Fact. Another fact is no one in the history of mankind died from cannabis use...ever!!! Non toxic unlike tobacco.more toxins in tea and coffee. I do not use any more but freedom to use would "clean" the business up. And maybe remove the criminal element from being involved due to high profit margins. saintinpattaya

6:41am Wed 14 Nov 12

100%HANTSBOY says...

Babsstanley says.....
"Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms."

And how many £billions will be sucked out of the countrys coffers when millions of Cannabis users from all over Europe flock to a country that they think already has streets paved with gold?
Babsstanley says..... "Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms." And how many £billions will be sucked out of the countrys coffers when millions of Cannabis users from all over Europe flock to a country that they think already has streets paved with gold? 100%HANTSBOY

7:24am Wed 14 Nov 12

debs1909 says...

What people need to understand is that cannabis affects different people different ways, for those who say it doesn't affect mental health your wrong, I have known some people who CANNOT smoke it as it causes them to be paranoid, if you have a tendency towards it, you will suffer with it
What people need to understand is that cannabis affects different people different ways, for those who say it doesn't affect mental health your wrong, I have known some people who CANNOT smoke it as it causes them to be paranoid, if you have a tendency towards it, you will suffer with it debs1909

8:06am Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

saintinpattaya wrote:
Informed Al is ill informed. You write sensationalist drivel. I am an engineer who smoked cannabis for over 15 years and my brain functions haven't suffered at all. I have more tolerance now of idiots like yourself that deny adults doing what they want to do in a victimless crime. Taliban production of heroin has increased. Only since the ccountry was overrun by ours and others military. Before that the farmers grew cannabis. Now up to 95% of western use of heroin comes from there. Fact. Another fact is no one in the history of mankind died from cannabis use...ever!!! Non toxic unlike tobacco.more toxins in tea and coffee. I do not use any more but freedom to use would "clean" the business up. And maybe remove the criminal element from being involved due to high profit margins.
You write total drivel then claim to be unaffected by your moronic habit. I would say grow up, but suspect it is far too late.
[quote][p][bold]saintinpattaya[/bold] wrote: Informed Al is ill informed. You write sensationalist drivel. I am an engineer who smoked cannabis for over 15 years and my brain functions haven't suffered at all. I have more tolerance now of idiots like yourself that deny adults doing what they want to do in a victimless crime. Taliban production of heroin has increased. Only since the ccountry was overrun by ours and others military. Before that the farmers grew cannabis. Now up to 95% of western use of heroin comes from there. Fact. Another fact is no one in the history of mankind died from cannabis use...ever!!! Non toxic unlike tobacco.more toxins in tea and coffee. I do not use any more but freedom to use would "clean" the business up. And maybe remove the criminal element from being involved due to high profit margins.[/p][/quote]You write total drivel then claim to be unaffected by your moronic habit. I would say grow up, but suspect it is far too late. Inform Al

8:09am Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

SuperSilverSourDiese
l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?
NONSENSE.

'''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health'''

Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense.

There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example.

In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects?

Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm.

“Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs
You obviously prefer to accept the sales talk of your dealer than the truth.
[quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: "The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?[/p][/quote]Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?[/p][/quote]NONSENSE. '''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health''' Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense. There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example. In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects? Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm. “Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs[/p][/quote]You obviously prefer to accept the sales talk of your dealer than the truth. Inform Al

8:13am Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

SuperSilverSourDiese
l
wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges.

Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself.

http://www.youtube.c

om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2

7w

The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia.

''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate''

Like i said, educate yourself

Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'.

So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true...

...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.
[quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.[/p][/quote]Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT. Inform Al

9:10am Wed 14 Nov 12

moreachesandpains says...

Uninformed Al - you present a better case for an end to prohibition than anyone else here. Welcome to our club. But I think you need to cut down on the alcohol - it's making you very angry and stressed - and that can kill you.
Uninformed Al - you present a better case for an end to prohibition than anyone else here. Welcome to our club. But I think you need to cut down on the alcohol - it's making you very angry and stressed - and that can kill you. moreachesandpains

10:37am Wed 14 Nov 12

AB3 says...

Babsstanley says.....
"Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms."

The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest.

Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality?

How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?)

No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel!

Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants.

Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low.

Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users
Babsstanley says..... "Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms." The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest. Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality? How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?) No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel! Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants. Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low. Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users AB3

11:05am Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

Amazing, isn't it! The people suggesting liberalisation of cannabis laws present their case in a logical manner, and present their evidence so that anyone may check it (Keele, Tashkin etc).

The prohibitionists simply resort to name calling and give no evidence, preferring to cite misconceptions and media hype.

Anyone with an unbiased mind reading through this thread will just laugh, as I do, at the posts made by those prohibitionists.
Amazing, isn't it! The people suggesting liberalisation of cannabis laws present their case in a logical manner, and present their evidence so that anyone may check it (Keele, Tashkin etc). The prohibitionists simply resort to name calling and give no evidence, preferring to cite misconceptions and media hype. Anyone with an unbiased mind reading through this thread will just laugh, as I do, at the posts made by those prohibitionists. Alan-_Hobday

11:19am Wed 14 Nov 12

Subject48 says...

3-4 years ago, a certain professor Nutt who was employed BY the government to be a chairman of a commission to decide which durgs are harmfull etc. and lend his extensive expertise to help create policy.

Inform al, do you know what happened.?

When he released a statement that canabis is basicaly ok, he was sacked from his position.

This very same government that has lied about wmd in iraq, wasted thousands of lives and billions of resources. so they can justify building new aircraft carriers and expenditure up for military production.

What you deduce from that, I would be interested to know.

@ inform al. Im dissapointed to see that when you cant come up with a counter argument you resort to:

"Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.”

I always thought you were a man of common sense. So you are claiming that all these people actualy existed and they all smoked cannabis ?? Blaming cannabis for selfish individual abusing religion is frankly, well... stupid.

I have a question for those diehard anti-fanatics, how many fo you ever tried cannabis?

As to argument that some people cant smoke it because it makes them "paranoid". those people never smoked again I trust? As with anything, over induglance is not good, like fast/fatty foods, cigarets,alcohol(lis
t could go on and on)

I have never seen anyone unable to move, slumped in their own vomit in a corner of a back alley after having a few smokes. I have seen it many times on a sturday/friday night however. I have never had anyone get abusive or violent towards me after a few smokes, I have with drunks.

Enough said.
3-4 years ago, a certain professor Nutt who was employed BY the government to be a chairman of a commission to decide which durgs are harmfull etc. and lend his extensive expertise to help create policy. Inform al, do you know what happened.? When he released a statement that canabis is basicaly ok, he was sacked from his position. This very same government that has lied about wmd in iraq, wasted thousands of lives and billions of resources. so they can justify building new aircraft carriers and expenditure up for military production. What you deduce from that, I would be interested to know. @ inform al. Im dissapointed to see that when you cant come up with a counter argument you resort to: "Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.” I always thought you were a man of common sense. So you are claiming that all these people actualy existed and they all smoked cannabis ?? Blaming cannabis for selfish individual abusing religion is frankly, well... stupid. I have a question for those diehard anti-fanatics, how many fo you ever tried cannabis? As to argument that some people cant smoke it because it makes them "paranoid". those people never smoked again I trust? As with anything, over induglance is not good, like fast/fatty foods, cigarets,alcohol(lis t could go on and on) I have never seen anyone unable to move, slumped in their own vomit in a corner of a back alley after having a few smokes. I have seen it many times on a sturday/friday night however. I have never had anyone get abusive or violent towards me after a few smokes, I have with drunks. Enough said. Subject48

11:51am Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese

l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected.

Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage.

But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary?

Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al?

Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis.

I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me.

We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be.

The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs.

Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected. Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage. But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary? Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al? Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis. I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me. We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be. The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs. Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though. Jack Herer

11:56am Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese

l
wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges.

Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself.

http://www.youtube.c


om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2


7w

The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia.

''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate''

Like i said, educate yourself

Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'.

So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true...

...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.
You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament?

Do you live your entire live this way?

Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?"

And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20

Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap?

You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.[/p][/quote]Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.[/p][/quote]You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament? Do you live your entire live this way? Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?" And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20 Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap? You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer? Jack Herer

12:03pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

AB3 wrote:
Babsstanley says.....
"Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms."

The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest.

Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality?

How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?)

No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel!

Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants.

Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low.

Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users
I think you missed the big memo.

The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis.

The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol.

The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is.

You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong.
[quote][p][bold]AB3[/bold] wrote: Babsstanley says..... "Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms." The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest. Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality? How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?) No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel! Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants. Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low. Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users[/p][/quote]I think you missed the big memo. The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis. The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol. The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is. You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong. Jack Herer

12:24pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
AB3 wrote:
Babsstanley says.....
"Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms."

The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest.

Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality?

How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?)

No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel!

Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants.

Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low.

Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users
I think you missed the big memo.

The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis.

The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol.

The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is.

You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong.
As someone said on another post recently, any nation that elects Bush, twice, has serious mental health problems.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]AB3[/bold] wrote: Babsstanley says..... "Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms." The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest. Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality? How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?) No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel! Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants. Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low. Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users[/p][/quote]I think you missed the big memo. The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis. The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol. The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is. You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong.[/p][/quote]As someone said on another post recently, any nation that elects Bush, twice, has serious mental health problems. Inform Al

12:26pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese


l
wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges.

Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself.

http://www.youtube.c



om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2



7w

The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia.

''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate''

Like i said, educate yourself

Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'.

So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true...

...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.
You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament?

Do you live your entire live this way?

Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?"

And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20

Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap?

You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?
Seems you are inhaling far too much
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.[/p][/quote]Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.[/p][/quote]You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament? Do you live your entire live this way? Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?" And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20 Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap? You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?[/p][/quote]Seems you are inhaling far too much Inform Al

12:30pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Subject48 says...

@ inform al, you not enough... ;)
@ inform al, you not enough... ;) Subject48

12:33pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese


l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected.

Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage.

But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary?

Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al?

Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis.

I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me.

We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be.

The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs.

Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though.
How I wish you were right. However in my very sheltered life I have to deal with far too many victims of cannabis and do have the first hand experience of the harm it causes to users, their families and sometimes the victims of paranoid schizophrenics.thank
s to cannabis usage. As I have said before only users will request that the evil stuff is legalised, and those brainwashed cretins will believe just what their scum dealer tells them.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected. Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage. But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary? Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al? Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis. I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me. We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be. The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs. Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though.[/p][/quote]How I wish you were right. However in my very sheltered life I have to deal with far too many victims of cannabis and do have the first hand experience of the harm it causes to users, their families and sometimes the victims of paranoid schizophrenics.thank s to cannabis usage. As I have said before only users will request that the evil stuff is legalised, and those brainwashed cretins will believe just what their scum dealer tells them. Inform Al

12:37pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Subject48 wrote:
3-4 years ago, a certain professor Nutt who was employed BY the government to be a chairman of a commission to decide which durgs are harmfull etc. and lend his extensive expertise to help create policy.

Inform al, do you know what happened.?

When he released a statement that canabis is basicaly ok, he was sacked from his position.

This very same government that has lied about wmd in iraq, wasted thousands of lives and billions of resources. so they can justify building new aircraft carriers and expenditure up for military production.

What you deduce from that, I would be interested to know.

@ inform al. Im dissapointed to see that when you cant come up with a counter argument you resort to:

"Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.”

I always thought you were a man of common sense. So you are claiming that all these people actualy existed and they all smoked cannabis ?? Blaming cannabis for selfish individual abusing religion is frankly, well... stupid.

I have a question for those diehard anti-fanatics, how many fo you ever tried cannabis?

As to argument that some people cant smoke it because it makes them "paranoid". those people never smoked again I trust? As with anything, over induglance is not good, like fast/fatty foods, cigarets,alcohol(lis

t could go on and on)

I have never seen anyone unable to move, slumped in their own vomit in a corner of a back alley after having a few smokes. I have seen it many times on a sturday/friday night however. I have never had anyone get abusive or violent towards me after a few smokes, I have with drunks.

Enough said.
The professors name was very appropriate, and apparently you think two wrongs make a right. Anything to legalise the stuff you smoke then?
[quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: 3-4 years ago, a certain professor Nutt who was employed BY the government to be a chairman of a commission to decide which durgs are harmfull etc. and lend his extensive expertise to help create policy. Inform al, do you know what happened.? When he released a statement that canabis is basicaly ok, he was sacked from his position. This very same government that has lied about wmd in iraq, wasted thousands of lives and billions of resources. so they can justify building new aircraft carriers and expenditure up for military production. What you deduce from that, I would be interested to know. @ inform al. Im dissapointed to see that when you cant come up with a counter argument you resort to: "Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.” I always thought you were a man of common sense. So you are claiming that all these people actualy existed and they all smoked cannabis ?? Blaming cannabis for selfish individual abusing religion is frankly, well... stupid. I have a question for those diehard anti-fanatics, how many fo you ever tried cannabis? As to argument that some people cant smoke it because it makes them "paranoid". those people never smoked again I trust? As with anything, over induglance is not good, like fast/fatty foods, cigarets,alcohol(lis t could go on and on) I have never seen anyone unable to move, slumped in their own vomit in a corner of a back alley after having a few smokes. I have seen it many times on a sturday/friday night however. I have never had anyone get abusive or violent towards me after a few smokes, I have with drunks. Enough said.[/p][/quote]The professors name was very appropriate, and apparently you think two wrongs make a right. Anything to legalise the stuff you smoke then? Inform Al

12:49pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Subject48 says...

I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic. Subject48

1:17pm Wed 14 Nov 12

SuperSilverSourDiesel says...

Subject48 wrote:
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
i guess its kinda like trying to teach a creationist about evolution. Forget the facts, the reality, and the truth...ill have some anecdotes, Daily Mail nonsense and some personal prejudice on the side please...

Consumed by the over 40 years of propaganda, let the sheep graze in their field of bullsh** i say.

Legal regulation, or some type of freedom is inevitable.
[quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.[/p][/quote]i guess its kinda like trying to teach a creationist about evolution. Forget the facts, the reality, and the truth...ill have some anecdotes, Daily Mail nonsense and some personal prejudice on the side please... Consumed by the over 40 years of propaganda, let the sheep graze in their field of bullsh** i say. Legal regulation, or some type of freedom is inevitable. SuperSilverSourDiesel

1:19pm Wed 14 Nov 12

SuperSilverSourDiesel says...

Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese

l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
"The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?"

Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?
Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?
NONSENSE.

'''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health'''

Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense.

There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example.

In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects?

Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm.

“Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs
You obviously prefer to accept the sales talk of your dealer than the truth.
Grow up you pathetic excuse for a human
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: "The only way to take that market back, and cut off their cash flow, is to legalise cannabis and place the market in the hands of legitimate traders operating within the mainstream economy?" Really? I can think of at least one other way, I'm sure there are more. How about educating people to be not so stupid and thus cut the demand?[/p][/quote]Have you missed the bit about the permanent damge cannabis does to mental health, Or is it too late for you?[/p][/quote]NONSENSE. '''permanent damge cannabis does to mental health''' Complete nonsense and dangerous misinformation. Professor Grinspoon, who has studied mental health and cannabis for over 40 years disagrees with your nonsense. There is no study that supports the idea that cannabis induces psychosis or schizophrenia. If you want to talk about cannabis and THC, we cant ignore the CBD which is a safe non psychoactive cannabinoid which has anti psychotic properties along with much more medicinal value. In countries that legally regulate cannabis, people with said mental illnesses are prescribed cannabis rich in CBD. It works with the THC to produce a calming effect and combats the effects of said mental illnesses allowing sufferer to cope and reduce symptoms. In Israel they have bred a strain of cannabis containing hardly any THC, but a massive amount of CBD. For people who dont need to feel the 'euphoric mood'. However THC has its own array of medicinal properties and therapeutic effects, so in the States and in Spain, they have developed strains with a 1:1 ratio. 8%THC 8%CBD for example. In the UK, cannabis is fully prohibited. Yet the golden rule of any dealer is to sell the strongest stuff for more profits. If cannabis users have no choice of different strains, and only High THC no CBD strains available, it may cause problems in certain susceptible individuals and young people when abused heavily. However, psychosis and schizophrenia will never ever be a side effect. To put things in perspective, alcohol users are 6times more likely to develop psychotic symptoms and psychological problems than cannabis users. I am in no way saying alcohol is guaranteed to cause said psychological problems, but it puts cannabis in perspective. Also, GWpharma who grow thousands of cannabis plants in Kent, sell the worlds most expensive cannabis. Its not cannabis 'based' medicine, its pure cannabis oil in tinctures. Its super concentrated. Street weed is 12-18% THC, GWpharma's Sativex (liquid cannabis) is around 50% THC. MUCH stronger than any herbal cannabis in Holland, let alone the UK. If cannabis caused said mental health problems, wouldnt that be stated in the List of Side effects? Cannabis is safer than aspirin. It being illegal has NOTHING to so with harm reduction. It being illegal is causing harm. “Many people who think of themselves as the beneficiaries of prohibition are really net losers. Parents are much more at risk of losing their children under prohibition than they would be if there was some kind of system where we had some measure of control over illicit drugs.” - Peter Baume Former Australian Minister for Health, Minister for Education & Minister for Aboriginal Affairs[/p][/quote]You obviously prefer to accept the sales talk of your dealer than the truth.[/p][/quote]Grow up you pathetic excuse for a human SuperSilverSourDiesel

1:21pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese



l
wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote:
Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense.

We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal.

The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present.

We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy.

Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine!

Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms.

The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut?

''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it''

That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back.

Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected.

Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage.

But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary?

Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al?

Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis.

I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me.

We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be.

The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs.

Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though.
How I wish you were right. However in my very sheltered life I have to deal with far too many victims of cannabis and do have the first hand experience of the harm it causes to users, their families and sometimes the victims of paranoid schizophrenics.thank

s to cannabis usage. As I have said before only users will request that the evil stuff is legalised, and those brainwashed cretins will believe just what their scum dealer tells them.
Lol, brilliant.

Do arch criminals have board meetings in your head, where they scheme up dastardly plans, whilst cackling manically? And these plans are then passed down to scum dealers, who then pass it down to brainwashed cretins (who then ironically make you look a fool online)?

Is that where you think the argument to legalise cannabis comes from? It was thought up at one of these super criminals meetings that happen all the time, and it was filtered down from there?

Don't logic, reason or science count for valid arguments on their own to you? Is that because the bible tells you different?

Look, I appreciate you are probably scared of cannabis, because your experience of it is exactly zero. But that doesn't mean you should fall hook line and sinker for the silly reefer madness nonsense.

James Bond isn't real you know. This picture of drugs you have is the stuff of Hollywood. It's as untrue as the made up victims of cannabis that you know "first hand". You don't know them do you? Why not just be honest then? You'll not get to heaven with lies.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Ah another one of those who "knows" people affected. Mysteriously however those people you know don't turn up at hospitals. Statistically, most hospitals don't even see a single cannabis admission all year. Compare that with our poor hospitals overflowing with alcohol or tobacco damage. But we are supposed to take your word for it about these people you know who've been "incurably mentally affected" by cannabis, even though it flies in the face of the clear evidence to the contrary? Erm, can you see why most people would think you are a complete liar Inform Al? Heroin finances the Taliban btw not "other drugs". Heroin is the drug which hugely damages society as well, not cannabis. I totally agree about stopping heroin. I don't think I've read any sensible posters with a harder approach to heroin use than me. Heroin dealers would regularly be receiving serious time if it was up to me. We aren't going to stop the terrible damage to society from heroin by targeting cannabis. It actually means we are going softer on heroin and making society much worst than it needs to be. The big problem is that morons like you genuinely aren't bright enough to make a simple differentiation between hard, harmful drugs, and soft, safer drugs. Either that, or you've led a totally sheltered and naive life, and are happy accordingly to take all your info from that tabloids, as if that somehow makes you fully informed. It clearly doesn't though.[/p][/quote]How I wish you were right. However in my very sheltered life I have to deal with far too many victims of cannabis and do have the first hand experience of the harm it causes to users, their families and sometimes the victims of paranoid schizophrenics.thank s to cannabis usage. As I have said before only users will request that the evil stuff is legalised, and those brainwashed cretins will believe just what their scum dealer tells them.[/p][/quote]Lol, brilliant. Do arch criminals have board meetings in your head, where they scheme up dastardly plans, whilst cackling manically? And these plans are then passed down to scum dealers, who then pass it down to brainwashed cretins (who then ironically make you look a fool online)? Is that where you think the argument to legalise cannabis comes from? It was thought up at one of these super criminals meetings that happen all the time, and it was filtered down from there? Don't logic, reason or science count for valid arguments on their own to you? Is that because the bible tells you different? Look, I appreciate you are probably scared of cannabis, because your experience of it is exactly zero. But that doesn't mean you should fall hook line and sinker for the silly reefer madness nonsense. James Bond isn't real you know. This picture of drugs you have is the stuff of Hollywood. It's as untrue as the made up victims of cannabis that you know "first hand". You don't know them do you? Why not just be honest then? You'll not get to heaven with lies. Jack Herer

1:27pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese



l
wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from?

I hope not!

Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges.

Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself.

http://www.youtube.c




om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2




7w

The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia.

''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate''

Like i said, educate yourself

Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'.

So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true...

...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.
You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament?

Do you live your entire live this way?

Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?"

And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20

Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap?

You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?
Seems you are inhaling far too much
Al, I hate to be the one to tell you this, but you definitely came up with this old testament stuff. You even used the words "old testament". It was your justification that cannabis was harmful. I was merely asking you about it.

Do you not remember? Did you black out? One last quick question; are you known to your local social services?

Sadly that last one is probably yes :(
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.[/p][/quote]Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.[/p][/quote]You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament? Do you live your entire live this way? Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?" And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20 Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap? You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?[/p][/quote]Seems you are inhaling far too much[/p][/quote]Al, I hate to be the one to tell you this, but you definitely came up with this old testament stuff. You even used the words "old testament". It was your justification that cannabis was harmful. I was merely asking you about it. Do you not remember? Did you black out? One last quick question; are you known to your local social services? Sadly that last one is probably yes :( Jack Herer

1:34pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Subject48 wrote:
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun
[quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.[/p][/quote]I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun Inform Al

1:46pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
AB3 wrote:
Babsstanley says.....
"Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms."

The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest.

Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality?

How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?)

No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel!

Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants.

Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low.

Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users
I think you missed the big memo.

The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis.

The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol.

The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is.

You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong.
As someone said on another post recently, any nation that elects Bush, twice, has serious mental health problems.
Jeez a whole nation and it's wonderful rich history written off by voting Bush in twice.

We are surely far worse by voting Blair in 3 times though. Who are we to comment on another nation's sanity therefore?

Are any nations sane do you think, if this voting thing, after the fact, is the benchmark?
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]AB3[/bold] wrote: Babsstanley says..... "Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms." The policy is ill-thought out and just would not work - start to license cultivation, tax sales as well as profits, add on the costs of rent, rates, insurance, wages etc etc etc (your belief that such a tax would be small is simply speculation) .. the result would be that those that presently grow cannabis to sell illegally could very easily undercut the outlets you suggest. Those caught? How would you punish them - where would be their victims, assuming they grow and sell good quality? How could you possibly "police" those that grow at home without a license, just as they do now and what would that policing cost - and how would you punish them (for what?) No, it is BAD POLICY created by leader Peter Reynolds who is clearly out to raise taxes for the Government he supports to spend more on bombs - he also advocates attacking Israel! Based upon the simple slogan "No Victim No Crime" a workable policy that recognises Human Rights would be simply to allow all people to grow their own plants in their own homes for their own use, just as they are allowed to grow poisonous plants. Allow retail outlets for adults - licensed and with quality controls, consumer protection and tax on profits - and licensed commercial cultivation to supply them, and keep the fees low. Reynolds and his little party claim to want to represent the interests of all users of cannabis in the UK yet the policy is simply to make them pay more; he has forgotten freedom of choice and Human Rights - he is acting more in the interests of the taxman than cannabis users[/p][/quote]I think you missed the big memo. The states of Colorado and Washington recently voted to legalise cannabis. The premise? That it was regulated like alcohol. The people have spoken. They do want to regulate cannabis like alcohol. This clearly wasn't Peter Reynold's idea either - it's laughable that you claim it is. You need to get over to Colorado double quick and tell them where they have gone so drastically wrong.[/p][/quote]As someone said on another post recently, any nation that elects Bush, twice, has serious mental health problems.[/p][/quote]Jeez a whole nation and it's wonderful rich history written off by voting Bush in twice. We are surely far worse by voting Blair in 3 times though. Who are we to comment on another nation's sanity therefore? Are any nations sane do you think, if this voting thing, after the fact, is the benchmark? Jack Herer

1:54pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
Subject48 wrote:
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun
Ah, so racism is the entire basis of your hatred towards cannabis.

That figures if you spent a lot of time in the Met.

To be honest I still don't believe you though. Your old testament stuff, plus your James Bond world view, leads me to believe that you were very much involved with Mind, yes, but unfortunately it was them helping you, rather than the other way round.

An experienced copper who genuinely doesn't know the difference between heroin and cannabis, and the vast difference in harm they cause, is actually a scary thought.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.[/p][/quote]I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun[/p][/quote]Ah, so racism is the entire basis of your hatred towards cannabis. That figures if you spent a lot of time in the Met. To be honest I still don't believe you though. Your old testament stuff, plus your James Bond world view, leads me to believe that you were very much involved with Mind, yes, but unfortunately it was them helping you, rather than the other way round. An experienced copper who genuinely doesn't know the difference between heroin and cannabis, and the vast difference in harm they cause, is actually a scary thought. Jack Herer

2:08pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Subject48 wrote:
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun
Ah, so racism is the entire basis of your hatred towards cannabis.

That figures if you spent a lot of time in the Met.

To be honest I still don't believe you though. Your old testament stuff, plus your James Bond world view, leads me to believe that you were very much involved with Mind, yes, but unfortunately it was them helping you, rather than the other way round.

An experienced copper who genuinely doesn't know the difference between heroin and cannabis, and the vast difference in harm they cause, is actually a scary thought.
You're weird, keep smoking the funny stuff. It's obviously too late now to save your brain. Don't suppose you'll ever be able to face reality again.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.[/p][/quote]I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun[/p][/quote]Ah, so racism is the entire basis of your hatred towards cannabis. That figures if you spent a lot of time in the Met. To be honest I still don't believe you though. Your old testament stuff, plus your James Bond world view, leads me to believe that you were very much involved with Mind, yes, but unfortunately it was them helping you, rather than the other way round. An experienced copper who genuinely doesn't know the difference between heroin and cannabis, and the vast difference in harm they cause, is actually a scary thought.[/p][/quote]You're weird, keep smoking the funny stuff. It's obviously too late now to save your brain. Don't suppose you'll ever be able to face reality again. Inform Al

2:30pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

Inform Al wrote:
Subject48 wrote:
I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough).

I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element.

I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint.

Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale.

But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society.

You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour.

If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument.

Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.
I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun
Ah yes I remember some of the "evidence" that was stated back then, purporting to back up claims of "cannabis psychosis". Things like "The subject just sat there muttering about Babylon". This is in quite normal behaviour if you ask me, when you consider that the word Babylon is often used by the Caribbean community as a nickname for the police, and he had just been arrested.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Subject48[/bold] wrote: I have met many more victims of alcoholism and tabaco smoking(my father included, who is religious and totally anti all-drugs strangely enough). I have honestly not met anyone with a serious problem related to cannabis. Apart from a slight lack of money I suppose, because prohibition makes it a very expensive commodity to the joy of the criminal element. I assume if you work in a field which deals with such individuals, obviously, you will have experiance biasing your viewpoint. Infrom Al, you are entitled to your opinion and I respect that. So if you dont want to, no one will force you to inhale. But the fact of life is the demand for cannabis(other drugs too) is and will be there. Always. It is not going away. The only thing you can do is mitigate, by introducing control mechanism which can generate income and put back into society. You make saving twofold, one, you create a whole new industry, two, you save money by unburnedning the police freeing up manpower and resource to deal with other issues such as anti social behaviour. If you wont listen to reason derived from scientific studies, at least consider the philosophical argument. Its a win win situation. I sincerely hope you can forget about what you believe in and use logic.[/p][/quote]I will let you into a little secret, back in the late 1960s as a Met Pleb I too frequently had to transport young West Indians to the Mental Health facility at Banstead when they had been deemed insane. I honestly thought the sun had affected their brains, at that time cannabis useage was almost exclusively confined to those of West Indian extraction and this was before the introduction of skunk. After moving to Southampton I became involved through 'Mind' in appropriate adulting for those with mental health issues in custody and was amazed at the almost 100% of schizophrenics that told me they had smoked cannabis in their teens. It took me a while to wake up, but the boiled West Indian brains had nothing to do with the sun[/p][/quote]Ah yes I remember some of the "evidence" that was stated back then, purporting to back up claims of "cannabis psychosis". Things like "The subject just sat there muttering about Babylon". This is in quite normal behaviour if you ask me, when you consider that the word Babylon is often used by the Caribbean community as a nickname for the police, and he had just been arrested. Alan-_Hobday

3:01pm Wed 14 Nov 12

SimonSomeone says...

The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u
k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S
GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum
ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way. SimonSomeone

3:51pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u

k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S

GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum

ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
To respond to the four claims made on that old page:


1) The smoke from herbal cannabis contains all the toxic constituents of smoke (apart from nicotine) including irritants, tumour initiators, tumour promoters and carcinogens, and carbon monoxide.....
The largest study of its kind has unexpectedly concluded that smoking marijuana, even regularly and heavily, does not lead to lung cancer: http://www.canorml.o
rg/healthfacts/tashk
inlungcancer.html

2) The tar from cannabis smoke also contains greater concentrations of benzanthracenes and benzpyrenes (both carcinogens) than tobacco smoke.......
I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave to the previous point

3) It has been estimated that smoking a cannabis cigarette (containing only herbal cannabis) results in an approximately five-fold greater increase in carboxyhaemoglobin* concentration, a three-fold greater increase in the amount of tar inhaled, and a retention in the respiratory tract of one third more tar than smoking a tobacco cigarette.....
Again this is covered by the response to the first point.

4) Every year, around 120,000 people in the UK who smoke tobacco cigarettes die as a result of their habit..... During the same period exactly zero people die as a result of their use.http://democrath
erald.com/news/opini
on/mailbag/mailbag-c
omparing-death-tolls
-cannabis-scores-zer
o/article_1833387e-e
e3b-11e1-a009-0019bb
2963f4.html
[quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]To respond to the four claims made on that old page: 1) The smoke from herbal cannabis contains all the toxic constituents of smoke (apart from nicotine) including irritants, tumour initiators, tumour promoters and carcinogens, and carbon monoxide..... The largest study of its kind has unexpectedly concluded that smoking marijuana, even regularly and heavily, does not lead to lung cancer: http://www.canorml.o rg/healthfacts/tashk inlungcancer.html 2) The tar from cannabis smoke also contains greater concentrations of benzanthracenes and benzpyrenes (both carcinogens) than tobacco smoke....... I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave to the previous point 3) It has been estimated that smoking a cannabis cigarette (containing only herbal cannabis) results in an approximately five-fold greater increase in carboxyhaemoglobin* concentration, a three-fold greater increase in the amount of tar inhaled, and a retention in the respiratory tract of one third more tar than smoking a tobacco cigarette..... Again this is covered by the response to the first point. 4) Every year, around 120,000 people in the UK who smoke tobacco cigarettes die as a result of their habit..... During the same period exactly zero people die as a result of their use.http://democrath erald.com/news/opini on/mailbag/mailbag-c omparing-death-tolls -cannabis-scores-zer o/article_1833387e-e e3b-11e1-a009-0019bb 2963f4.html Alan-_Hobday

4:11pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

The stunning thing for me is not that the 'antis' consider that cannabis is harmful but that they consider the policy of prohibition to be beneficial.
The stunning thing for me is not that the 'antis' consider that cannabis is harmful but that they consider the policy of prohibition to be beneficial. Alan-_Hobday

4:25pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

One of the harms of prohibition has been to cause the marketing of cannabis that is very low in CBD, due to being harvested in an immature state. CBD is a strong anti-psychotic:

"Drug Test Anal. 2012 Oct 25. doi: 10.1002/dta.1425.
Medical use of cannabis. Cannabidiol: A new light for schizophrenia?
Deiana S.
SourceDepartment CNS Diseases Research, Boehringer Ingelheim Pharma GmbH & Co. K., Biberach an der Riss, Germany.

Abstract
The medical properties of cannabis have been known for many centuries; its first documented use dates back to 2800 BC when it was described for its hallucinogenic and pain-relieving properties. In the first half of the twentieth century, a number of pharmaceutical companies marked cannabis for indications such as asthma and pain, but since then its use has sharply declined, mainly due to its unpredictable effects, but also for socio-political issues. Recently, great attention has been directed to the medical properties of phytocannabinoids present in the cannabis plant alongside the main constituent Δ(9) -Tetrahydrocannabino
l (THC); these include cannabinoids such as cannabidiol (CBD), cannabigerol (CBG), and tetrahydrocannabivar
in (THCV). Evidence suggests an association between cannabis and schizophrenia: schizophrenics show a higher use of marijuana as compared to the healthy population. Additionally, the use of marijuana can trigger psychotic episodes in schizophrenic patients, and this has been ascribed to THC. Given the need to reduce the side effects of marketed antipsychotics, and their weak efficacy on some schizophrenic symptoms, cannabinoids have been suggested as a possible alternative treatment for schizophrenia. CBD, a non-psychoactive constituent of the Cannabis sativa plant, has been receiving growing attention for its anti-psychotic-like properties. Evidence suggests that CBD can ameliorate positive and negative symptoms of schizophrenia. Behavioural and neurochemical models suggest that CBD has a pharmacological profile similar to that of atypical anti-psychotic drugs and a clinical trial reported that this cannabinoid is a well-tolerated alternative treatment for schizophrenia. Copyright © 2012 John Wiley & Sons, Ltd."


http://www.ncbi.nlm.
nih.gov/pubmed/23109
356
One of the harms of prohibition has been to cause the marketing of cannabis that is very low in CBD, due to being harvested in an immature state. CBD is a strong anti-psychotic: "Drug Test Anal. 2012 Oct 25. doi: 10.1002/dta.1425. [Epub ahead of print] Medical use of cannabis. Cannabidiol: A new light for schizophrenia? Deiana S. SourceDepartment CNS Diseases Research, Boehringer Ingelheim Pharma GmbH & Co. K., Biberach an der Riss, Germany. Abstract The medical properties of cannabis have been known for many centuries; its first documented use dates back to 2800 BC when it was described for its hallucinogenic and pain-relieving properties. In the first half of the twentieth century, a number of pharmaceutical companies marked cannabis for indications such as asthma and pain, but since then its use has sharply declined, mainly due to its unpredictable effects, but also for socio-political issues. Recently, great attention has been directed to the medical properties of phytocannabinoids present in the cannabis plant alongside the main constituent Δ(9) -Tetrahydrocannabino l (THC); these include cannabinoids such as cannabidiol (CBD), cannabigerol (CBG), and tetrahydrocannabivar in (THCV). Evidence suggests an association between cannabis and schizophrenia: schizophrenics show a higher use of marijuana as compared to the healthy population. Additionally, the use of marijuana can trigger psychotic episodes in schizophrenic patients, and this has been ascribed to THC. Given the need to reduce the side effects of marketed antipsychotics, and their weak efficacy on some schizophrenic symptoms, cannabinoids have been suggested as a possible alternative treatment for schizophrenia. CBD, a non-psychoactive constituent of the Cannabis sativa plant, has been receiving growing attention for its anti-psychotic-like properties. Evidence suggests that CBD can ameliorate positive and negative symptoms of schizophrenia. Behavioural and neurochemical models suggest that CBD has a pharmacological profile similar to that of atypical anti-psychotic drugs and a clinical trial reported that this cannabinoid is a well-tolerated alternative treatment for schizophrenia. Copyright © 2012 John Wiley & Sons, Ltd." http://www.ncbi.nlm. nih.gov/pubmed/23109 356 Alan-_Hobday

5:11pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u

k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S

GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum

ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio
tech.com/press-relea
ses/cannabis-science
-publishes-list-over
-800-peer-reviewed-c
annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
[quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone. Jack Herer

6:36pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u


k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S


GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum


ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio

tech.com/press-relea

ses/cannabis-science

-publishes-list-over

-800-peer-reviewed-c

annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis. Inform Al

6:51pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

Still no real case for prohibition having any benefits then? Of course not, as it does nothing but harm.
Still no real case for prohibition having any benefits then? Of course not, as it does nothing but harm. Alan-_Hobday

6:58pm Wed 14 Nov 12

Alan-_Hobday says...

And that old house of cards is falling down very quickly now, just look at this:

Rhode Island, Maine, Vermont and Massachusetts all going down the path of good sense.....
http://reason.com/bl
og/2012/11/14/state-
legislators-in-rhode
-island-and-ma
And that old house of cards is falling down very quickly now, just look at this: Rhode Island, Maine, Vermont and Massachusetts all going down the path of good sense..... http://reason.com/bl og/2012/11/14/state- legislators-in-rhode -island-and-ma Alan-_Hobday

8:19pm Wed 14 Nov 12

cantthinkofone says...

Dear prohibitionists.

Please google "Ben Goldacre cherry-picking".

Thanks.
Dear prohibitionists. Please google "Ben Goldacre cherry-picking". Thanks. cantthinkofone

7:45am Thu 15 Nov 12

rich the stitch says...

Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u



k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S



GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum



ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio


tech.com/press-relea


ses/cannabis-science


-publishes-list-over


-800-peer-reviewed-c


annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up?
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.[/p][/quote]At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up? rich the stitch

7:50am Thu 15 Nov 12

rich the stitch says...

The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't.
The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't. rich the stitch

8:04am Thu 15 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u



k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S



GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum



ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio


tech.com/press-relea


ses/cannabis-science


-publishes-list-over


-800-peer-reviewed-c


annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
You'll stick to the truth? And then you claim that cannabis "causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users"!

With 3 million regular cannabis users in the UK, and millions more who are casual users, we are surely looking at mental health meltdown right now.

Except we aren't are we.

Indeed we see very few people admitted to hospital for cannabis use. Statistically in fact, alcohol is around six times worse than cannabis for mental health issues alone.

Therefore does alcohol cause "irrepairable mental illness" to at least 60% of users?
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.[/p][/quote]You'll stick to the truth? And then you claim that cannabis "causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users"! With 3 million regular cannabis users in the UK, and millions more who are casual users, we are surely looking at mental health meltdown right now. Except we aren't are we. Indeed we see very few people admitted to hospital for cannabis use. Statistically in fact, alcohol is around six times worse than cannabis for mental health issues alone. Therefore does alcohol cause "irrepairable mental illness" to at least 60% of users? Jack Herer

8:11am Thu 15 Nov 12

Jack Herer says...

rich the stitch wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u




k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S




GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum




ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio



tech.com/press-relea



ses/cannabis-science



-publishes-list-over



-800-peer-reviewed-c



annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up?
Of course he can't back up that figure.

It's pure fiction.

If at least 10% of users have this damage then why aren't our hospitals awash with cannabis victims? Why haven't our hospitals been swamped for decades in fact?

Hardly anyone goes to hospital with cannabis problems is the cold hard truth. Whilst our hospitals really are swamped with alcohol related issues.

Inform Al has no argument to defend cannabis prohibition, so he has to resort to lying. Sad but true.

Why not just embrace science, reason and the truth is the big question? It's a philosophy which has carried mankind's progress since the dark ages. Why do we ignore those cornerstones of civilisation when it comes to cannabis?
[quote][p][bold]rich the stitch[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.[/p][/quote]At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up?[/p][/quote]Of course he can't back up that figure. It's pure fiction. If at least 10% of users have this damage then why aren't our hospitals awash with cannabis victims? Why haven't our hospitals been swamped for decades in fact? Hardly anyone goes to hospital with cannabis problems is the cold hard truth. Whilst our hospitals really are swamped with alcohol related issues. Inform Al has no argument to defend cannabis prohibition, so he has to resort to lying. Sad but true. Why not just embrace science, reason and the truth is the big question? It's a philosophy which has carried mankind's progress since the dark ages. Why do we ignore those cornerstones of civilisation when it comes to cannabis? Jack Herer

10:48am Thu 15 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
rich the stitch wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u





k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S





GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum





ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio




tech.com/press-relea




ses/cannabis-science




-publishes-list-over




-800-peer-reviewed-c




annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up?
Of course he can't back up that figure.

It's pure fiction.

If at least 10% of users have this damage then why aren't our hospitals awash with cannabis victims? Why haven't our hospitals been swamped for decades in fact?

Hardly anyone goes to hospital with cannabis problems is the cold hard truth. Whilst our hospitals really are swamped with alcohol related issues.

Inform Al has no argument to defend cannabis prohibition, so he has to resort to lying. Sad but true.

Why not just embrace science, reason and the truth is the big question? It's a philosophy which has carried mankind's progress since the dark ages. Why do we ignore those cornerstones of civilisation when it comes to cannabis?
How nice of you to stupidly answer for me. As the correlation of those adversly affected by this dangerous drug is very similar to the percentage of us accepted to be capable of becoming alcoholic I shan't be bothering to waste loads of words in responding to you addicts.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]rich the stitch[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.[/p][/quote]At least 10% of users? That seems very high, can you back it up?[/p][/quote]Of course he can't back up that figure. It's pure fiction. If at least 10% of users have this damage then why aren't our hospitals awash with cannabis victims? Why haven't our hospitals been swamped for decades in fact? Hardly anyone goes to hospital with cannabis problems is the cold hard truth. Whilst our hospitals really are swamped with alcohol related issues. Inform Al has no argument to defend cannabis prohibition, so he has to resort to lying. Sad but true. Why not just embrace science, reason and the truth is the big question? It's a philosophy which has carried mankind's progress since the dark ages. Why do we ignore those cornerstones of civilisation when it comes to cannabis?[/p][/quote]How nice of you to stupidly answer for me. As the correlation of those adversly affected by this dangerous drug is very similar to the percentage of us accepted to be capable of becoming alcoholic I shan't be bothering to waste loads of words in responding to you addicts. Inform Al

10:52am Thu 15 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Jack Herer wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote:
The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe".

http://web.bma.org.u




k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S




GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum




ent&vw=wfmms

Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst.

In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.
It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking.

Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange?

By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true.

It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis;

http://www.fiercebio



tech.com/press-relea



ses/cannabis-science



-publishes-list-over



-800-peer-reviewed-c



annabis-and-cancer-

There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients.

In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users.

The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view.

When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie?

Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.
You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.
You'll stick to the truth? And then you claim that cannabis "causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users"!

With 3 million regular cannabis users in the UK, and millions more who are casual users, we are surely looking at mental health meltdown right now.

Except we aren't are we.

Indeed we see very few people admitted to hospital for cannabis use. Statistically in fact, alcohol is around six times worse than cannabis for mental health issues alone.

Therefore does alcohol cause "irrepairable mental illness" to at least 60% of users?
You've got your facts wrong, it's 10% of us that are capable of becoming alcoholics, and our hospitals are not full of alcoholics either. We as humans use strategies to hide our illnesses so the truth, bit like an iceberrg, stays mainly hidden. We only get to see the extrtemes.
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: The stunning thing for me not so much that the "pros" keep trotting out the same discredited nonsense, but that they try to convince everyone else that their nasty habit is "safe". http://web.bma.org.u k/pressrel.nsf/wlu/S GOY-5VDDHQ?OpenDocum ent&vw=wfmms Will someone who thinks that the state should legalise this stuff please interpret this for me? And there are many more like this, from the most respected bodies, that are easy to reference to. Citing individuals who claim otherwise is disingenuous at best, dangerous at worst. In any stream, you will find a fish swimming the wrong way. It does not mean that the stream is in fact going the other way.[/p][/quote]It's true that when burnt, cannabis contains some of the exact same carcinogens as tobacco. It's also true that millions die every year worldwide from lung cancer from tobacco smoking. Here's the really, really weird thing though; no one is contracting cancer solely through smoking cannabis. Isn't that strange? By far the biggest study on the subject, done by the recognised world's leading expert, surprisingly found that smoking cannabis actually makes you less likely to contract cancer than not smoking anything at all. Amazing but true. It's less amazing however when one realises that a list was recently published with over 800 peer reviewed scientific studies which all showed the anti-cancer properties of cannabis; http://www.fiercebio tech.com/press-relea ses/cannabis-science -publishes-list-over -800-peer-reviewed-c annabis-and-cancer- There is serious anecdotal evidence of cannabis oil - the purest form of the drug - curing cancer patients. In the two biggest social studies into cannabis - in Jamaica and Puerto Rico in the 1970's - they found cannabis users live on average one and a half to two years longer than non users. The truth about cannabis isn't your highly selective, skewed tabloid view. When the government sacks it's own scientific adviser for simply telling the truth about cannabis, then surely you must know the government message on cannabis is a lie. Why would you want to perpetuate a lie? Sooner or later you need to realise that you are fish who is actually swimming the wrong way SimonSomeone.[/p][/quote]You pick out the 'facts' you wish to believe to justify your stupid habit. I'll stick to the truth. Cannabis is a dangerous drug that causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users. You of course will claim that the increase in diagnosed schizophrenics is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the increase of cretins using cannabis.[/p][/quote]You'll stick to the truth? And then you claim that cannabis "causes irrepairable mental illness to at least 10% of users"! With 3 million regular cannabis users in the UK, and millions more who are casual users, we are surely looking at mental health meltdown right now. Except we aren't are we. Indeed we see very few people admitted to hospital for cannabis use. Statistically in fact, alcohol is around six times worse than cannabis for mental health issues alone. Therefore does alcohol cause "irrepairable mental illness" to at least 60% of users?[/p][/quote]You've got your facts wrong, it's 10% of us that are capable of becoming alcoholics, and our hospitals are not full of alcoholics either. We as humans use strategies to hide our illnesses so the truth, bit like an iceberrg, stays mainly hidden. We only get to see the extrtemes. Inform Al

10:56am Thu 15 Nov 12

Inform Al says...

rich the stitch wrote:
The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't.
Perhaps I should have explained that by 'user' I do not include those that may occasionally be weak enough to accept a joint. I refer to the hard core cretins.
[quote][p][bold]rich the stitch[/bold] wrote: The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't.[/p][/quote]Perhaps I should have explained that by 'user' I do not include those that may occasionally be weak enough to accept a joint. I refer to the hard core cretins. Inform Al

11:12am Thu 15 Nov 12

rich the stitch says...

Inform Al wrote:
rich the stitch wrote: The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't.
Perhaps I should have explained that by 'user' I do not include those that may occasionally be weak enough to accept a joint. I refer to the hard core cretins.
Yes you should have explained that by ‘user’ you ‘meant hard core cretins’, as you put it. I think you’re find most people will refer to a ‘user’ as exactly that. Not an addict – which is what I think you mean. So, your experience of the evils of cannabis has been by meeting people who smoke far too much, which has lead to some sort of psychosis?
You are comparing hard core cannabis users to people who enjoy the odd joint every now and again on a recreational basis. Is that not the same as comparing the wino down the park to the guy having a weekend pint? It's all about moderation.
I'm still interested in seeing where you got those figures of 10% from.
Oh, and name calling does not make your argument any more feasible, in fact it dilutes it somewhat.
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]rich the stitch[/bold] wrote: The problem is moderation. Smoke a couple of joints a week, no problem. Smoke to excess everyday you're gonna do some harm. Inform al, I don't doubt you have met many people who have had a problem with cannabis. How many if these were smoking to excess? It's like saying everyone who drinks alcohol is going to become a violent alcoholic, some will, a large majority won't.[/p][/quote]Perhaps I should have explained that by 'user' I do not include those that may occasionally be weak enough to accept a joint. I refer to the hard core cretins.[/p][/quote]Yes you should have explained that by ‘user’ you ‘meant hard core cretins’, as you put it. I think you’re find most people will refer to a ‘user’ as exactly that. Not an addict – which is what I think you mean. So, your experience of the evils of cannabis has been by meeting people who smoke far too much, which has lead to some sort of psychosis? You are comparing hard core cannabis users to people who enjoy the odd joint every now and again on a recreational basis. Is that not the same as comparing the wino down the park to the guy having a weekend pint? It's all about moderation. I'm still interested in seeing where you got those figures of 10% from. Oh, and name calling does not make your argument any more feasible, in fact it dilutes it somewhat. rich the stitch

8:25am Sat 17 Nov 12

Dr Martin says...

Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese l wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
Babs Stanley wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.
Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.
Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.
Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.
Al, I am with you on this argument many posters are unaware of prolonged and or heavy use of cannabis which take up a lot of time of the mental health services and are a 'factor' in many cases seen by the mental health teams.
I would also like to congratulate the police force on finding this cannabis; I certainly don’t think this is a waste of their time
[quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Babs Stanley[/bold] wrote: Why don't we try taking a completely new approach to cannabis? In Britain, 30% of us use cannabis in our lifetime, three million people use it at least once per month and we consume more than three tonnes every day. The idea that we can prevent people using it is nonsense. We waste billions every year on police, court and prison resources when a large proportion of society uses cannabis without any problem at all. In fact, the only real problem with cannabis is that it's illegal. The risks to health are very small - much, much less than alcohol or tobacco. Professor Terrie Moffitt of the Institute of Psychiatry said recently that cannabis is "safe for over 18s". If we took responsibility and introduced a tax and regulate system we could protect children far more effectively than we do at present. We could have a properly regulated supply chain with no criminals involved, no theft of electricity, no human trafficking, no destruction of property and disruption of neighbourhoods. Then there would be some control over this huge market. There would be thousands of new jobs, sales would be from licensed outlets to adults only with guaranteed quality and safety. Then our police could start going after some real wrongdoing instead of trying to fight a crime that exists only because of a misguided government policy. Also, very importantly, science now proves that cannabis is one of the safest and most effective medicines for a wide range of conditions. While the government promotes the lie that "there is no medicinal value in cannabis", it has granted an unlawful monopoly to GW Pharmaceuticals to grow 20 tonnes a year for, you guessed it, medicine! Cannabis Law Reform (CLEAR) published independent research last year that shows a cannabis tax and regulate policy would provide a boost to the UK economy of up to £9.3 billion pa as well as reducing all health and social harms. The only thing that keeps the present absurd status quo in place is weak politicians corrupted by Big Booze and the GW Pharma monopoly.[/p][/quote]Not many people get themselves murdered so it would probably be cheaper to ignore murders and just let them get on with it. Or more realistically as too many murders and serious assaults are committed by nutcases who got that way by smoking cannabis just execute the dealers and save on the prison costs.[/p][/quote]Is this another one who cannot see the difference between someone smoking a plant (safer than aspirin) and murder? Seriously? That old chestnut? ''Well why dont we legalize rape while where at it'' That argument has been destroyed so many times its unreal. Go away, inform yourself, understand the dangers of prohibition and what the current drugs policy is doing to society as a whole, then come back. Until then you have no real argument.[/p][/quote]Having worked with the cretins who have been incurably mentally affected by this dangerous drug, defended only by idiots who are addicted to it, or are simply morons, I can through experience say this is not a harmless drug but one that has destroyed many lives.As muich of it now comes to us, with other drugs, to finance the Taliban it has an even more obnoxious effect on civilized society than just the drug effect alone. Execute the dealers and the traitors who are financing civilizations enemies.[/p][/quote]Al, I am with you on this argument many posters are unaware of prolonged and or heavy use of cannabis which take up a lot of time of the mental health services and are a 'factor' in many cases seen by the mental health teams. I would also like to congratulate the police force on finding this cannabis; I certainly don’t think this is a waste of their time Dr Martin

9:00am Sat 17 Nov 12

Dr Martin says...

Jack Herer wrote:
Inform Al wrote:
SuperSilverSourDiese l wrote:
SimonSomeone wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.
Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.
Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.
You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament? Do you live your entire live this way? Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?" And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20 Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap? You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?
To SuperSilverSourDiese
l

"Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia"

You didnt give all the inforamtion just put half the information to suit your argument
let me share a more substantial quote
"Drugs do not directly cause schizophrenia. However, there is evidence consistent with the view that certain drugs such as cannabis can trigger psychosis."
[quote][p][bold]Jack Herer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Inform Al[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SuperSilverSourDiese l[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SimonSomeone[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that "the old chestnut" of smoking cannabis is safe still exists. You ignore the overwhelming mass of evidence, research and opinion of scientists, surgeons and doctors who state that it is significantly more dangerous than tobacco, which would also not be legalised today. So you are asking the state to legalise something which is a significant risk to health, is known to cause psychotic episodes (it's a psychoactive drug which is kind of the point isn't it?) and turns the 30% into boring, moronic numpties that the over 70% can't wait to get away from? I hope not! Check out the articles on the BMA or British Lung Foundation websites, or any of the huge number of other bodies which state the risks clearly.[/p][/quote]Can you tell me where i said cannabis is safe? I said its safer than aspirin, because that is what science acknowledges. Its not more dangerous than tobacco, thats nonsense and the largest study of its kind has proved its not just not as bad as tobacco, its MUCH safer. In fact, smoking cannabis without tobacco has NO association with COPD, lung/head/neck cancer. You have been LIED to, Seek Pulmonary Researcher Donald Tashkin's Research to educate yourself. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=wFNzezbc2 7w The British Association for Psychopharmacology disagrees with your other nonsense about psychotic episodes, Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia. ''Although cannabis use increased 10-20 fold over the last 40 years, the number of people with psychosis didn't, indeed, it looks like there might be a downward trend in schizophrenia admissions. If there was a direct link, you might expect to see levels in both either rise or fall together. If there is a link between cannabis use and psychosis it is likely to be complicated, and it is still not clear in which direction an effect occurs. It may be that the link is seen because people who already have psychosis find that smoking cannabis alleviates symptoms like social anxiety, so they smoke to self medicate'' Like i said, educate yourself Your naive to believe the BLF who have FAILED to back up their claims. And who fail to mention Tashkins Research, who was described by professor Nutt as 'Scaremongering'. So it seems you have made yourself look stupid in the eyes who know about cannabis. But if all what you say is true, which its not, (its simply another example of the result of REEFERMADNESS propaganda) If all the negatives are true... ...Why on earth would you support prohibition which has GIFTED criminals control over this plant by disallowing regulation? Such a dangerous evil plant...Yea, the one humans have used non problematically for over 10,000 years? That plant? Or the policy which has NOTHING to do with harm reduction. And you blindly support it. Disgusting.[/p][/quote]Yes, it's been used for many years and was probably used by the old testament guy, Ishmael to the Muslims and I think Abraham to the Jewish, who heard voices telling him to sacrifice his son to God. Totally harmless - NOT.[/p][/quote]You are basing your information that cannabis is harmful on vague stories from the old testament? Do you live your entire live this way? Do you not shave for instance because Leviticus 19:27 says; “‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard?" And how do you avoid women at that time of the month; "When a woman has a discharge of blood, which is her regular discharge from her body, she shall be in her impurity for seven days, and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening." -- Leviticus 15:19-20 Are you Amish by any chance? Are zips and buttons considered modern abominations in your house, and do you travel everywhere by pony and trap? You do know that you are going to hell for using a computer?[/p][/quote]To SuperSilverSourDiese l "Cannabis cannot cause psychosis or schizophrenia" You didnt give all the inforamtion just put half the information to suit your argument let me share a more substantial quote "Drugs do not directly cause schizophrenia. However, there is evidence consistent with the view that certain drugs such as cannabis can trigger psychosis." Dr Martin

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