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12:31pm Fri 29 Aug 14

jazzi says...

Who gives you the right to force treatment on an innocent. I do not know the circumstances , but perhaps they want him to be happy in his last days and not wired up like a lab rat, just sayin !!!
Who gives you the right to force treatment on an innocent. I do not know the circumstances , but perhaps they want him to be happy in his last days and not wired up like a lab rat, just sayin !!! jazzi
  • Score: -4

12:40pm Fri 29 Aug 14

IronLady2010 says...

According to other news sources the parents are Jehovah’s Witnesses, this kind of says it all.

Let's hope this poorly child is found soon and can have the treatment he deserves.

Good luck xx
According to other news sources the parents are Jehovah’s Witnesses, this kind of says it all. Let's hope this poorly child is found soon and can have the treatment he deserves. Good luck xx IronLady2010
  • Score: -12

12:53pm Fri 29 Aug 14

Donald2000 says...

This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this. Donald2000
  • Score: 8

1:07pm Fri 29 Aug 14

sotonboy84 says...

So the gist of this 'breaking headline' seems to be that the parents have their photographs branded across the Echo and are being treated like criminals because they took their child from hospital. The police say he wasn't unhooked from any equipment and say they do not know if the child was allowed to leave hospital.

Journalism in this country is scandalous. Anything to sell a story. Anybody remember the story of Joanna Yates who was murdered in Bristol? Her landlord was a suspect and had his life destroyed by the media who portrayed him as guilty, until they found the real killer.

There needs to be far more control and measures over how news is reported because journalists seem to be able to report however they like, regardless of the circumstances.
So the gist of this 'breaking headline' seems to be that the parents have their photographs branded across the Echo and are being treated like criminals because they took their child from hospital. The police say he wasn't unhooked from any equipment and say they do not know if the child was allowed to leave hospital. Journalism in this country is scandalous. Anything to sell a story. Anybody remember the story of Joanna Yates who was murdered in Bristol? Her landlord was a suspect and had his life destroyed by the media who portrayed him as guilty, until they found the real killer. There needs to be far more control and measures over how news is reported because journalists seem to be able to report however they like, regardless of the circumstances. sotonboy84
  • Score: 21

1:11pm Fri 29 Aug 14

sotonboy84 says...

Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
[quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals. sotonboy84
  • Score: 12

1:13pm Fri 29 Aug 14

vag says...

Poor little sod. Born to exceptionally poor quality parents. He will be dead in a few hours, without quality medical care. I hope the parents can live with that.
Poor little sod. Born to exceptionally poor quality parents. He will be dead in a few hours, without quality medical care. I hope the parents can live with that. vag
  • Score: -18

1:15pm Fri 29 Aug 14

Brite Spark says...

maybe they've taken him to Lourdes.
maybe they've taken him to Lourdes. Brite Spark
  • Score: -1

1:18pm Fri 29 Aug 14

IronLady2010 says...

sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
[quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar? IronLady2010
  • Score: -7

3:41pm Fri 29 Aug 14

owenmahamilton says...

If he does pass away I hope the hospital is found partially responsible for waiting so long before deciding to call the police.
If he does pass away I hope the hospital is found partially responsible for waiting so long before deciding to call the police. owenmahamilton
  • Score: -12

4:02pm Fri 29 Aug 14

sotonboy84 says...

IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
There's no such thing as a critical list.

You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected.

You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.
[quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?[/p][/quote]There's no such thing as a critical list. You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected. You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient. sotonboy84
  • Score: 7

8:14pm Fri 29 Aug 14

spud_124 says...

I have just read the story in the echo that a young boy has been snached from southampton g/h. I feel that all patients should have a security tag on their wrist/leg. As all clothe shops has, as you go through the doors a alarm bell rings .I know it would cost, but its a small price to pay for a loved one. help find this young boy.
I have just read the story in the echo that a young boy has been snached from southampton g/h. I feel that all patients should have a security tag on their wrist/leg. As all clothe shops has, as you go through the doors a alarm bell rings .I know it would cost, but its a small price to pay for a loved one. help find this young boy. spud_124
  • Score: -5

9:35pm Fri 29 Aug 14

Graeme Harrison says...

sotonboy84 wrote:
IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
There's no such thing as a critical list.

You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected.

You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.
Except, of course, if you're not competent to make decisions about your medical treatment, the Court of Protection can authorise doctors to give you treatment even if you've refused it. In the case of minors, the High Court can authorise treatment against the wishes of parents if it's in the minor's interests to have the treatment.
[quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?[/p][/quote]There's no such thing as a critical list. You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected. You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.[/p][/quote]Except, of course, if you're not competent to make decisions about your medical treatment, the Court of Protection can authorise doctors to give you treatment even if you've refused it. In the case of minors, the High Court can authorise treatment against the wishes of parents if it's in the minor's interests to have the treatment. Graeme Harrison
  • Score: 0

9:56pm Fri 29 Aug 14

BeyondImagination says...

owenmahamilton wrote:
If he does pass away I hope the hospital is found partially responsible for waiting so long before deciding to call the police.
Hospitals are not prisons. In this case the parents had permission to take him off site.

I wish the boy and his family well.
[quote][p][bold]owenmahamilton[/bold] wrote: If he does pass away I hope the hospital is found partially responsible for waiting so long before deciding to call the police.[/p][/quote]Hospitals are not prisons. In this case the parents had permission to take him off site. I wish the boy and his family well. BeyondImagination
  • Score: 4

9:57pm Fri 29 Aug 14

sotonboy84 says...

Graeme Harrison wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
There's no such thing as a critical list.

You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected.

You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.
Except, of course, if you're not competent to make decisions about your medical treatment, the Court of Protection can authorise doctors to give you treatment even if you've refused it. In the case of minors, the High Court can authorise treatment against the wishes of parents if it's in the minor's interests to have the treatment.
Yes of course but I was focussing on where I believe the misunderstanding regarding a 'critical list' came from. Not all the technicalities around refusing treatment as the list is exhaustive & complex.

A court can overrule a parents decision if medical professionals think it's wrong. In this case the media have portrayed the parents as criminals before anybody knows what's happened which is very wrong.
[quote][p][bold]Graeme Harrison[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?[/p][/quote]There's no such thing as a critical list. You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected. You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.[/p][/quote]Except, of course, if you're not competent to make decisions about your medical treatment, the Court of Protection can authorise doctors to give you treatment even if you've refused it. In the case of minors, the High Court can authorise treatment against the wishes of parents if it's in the minor's interests to have the treatment.[/p][/quote]Yes of course but I was focussing on where I believe the misunderstanding regarding a 'critical list' came from. Not all the technicalities around refusing treatment as the list is exhaustive & complex. A court can overrule a parents decision if medical professionals think it's wrong. In this case the media have portrayed the parents as criminals before anybody knows what's happened which is very wrong. sotonboy84
  • Score: 4

6:36am Sat 30 Aug 14

elvisimo says...

sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
And the bbc and itv and the world press, french police etc. maybe they are trying to save a life?
[quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]And the bbc and itv and the world press, french police etc. maybe they are trying to save a life? elvisimo
  • Score: -3

12:48pm Sat 30 Aug 14

IronLady2010 says...

sotonboy84 wrote:
IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
There's no such thing as a critical list.

You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected.

You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.
Thanks for explaining.

I guess my mistake came as I compared it to say a couple whereby one is severely ill and wants to die, the partner can not assist them. I wrongly assumed that the parents in this case know the child is likely to die and are in a way assisting with his death.

My mistake and I hold my hands up to that. x
[quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?[/p][/quote]There's no such thing as a critical list. You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected. You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.[/p][/quote]Thanks for explaining. I guess my mistake came as I compared it to say a couple whereby one is severely ill and wants to die, the partner can not assist them. I wrongly assumed that the parents in this case know the child is likely to die and are in a way assisting with his death. My mistake and I hold my hands up to that. x IronLady2010
  • Score: 0

7:21pm Sat 30 Aug 14

sotonboy84 says...

IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
IronLady2010 wrote:
sotonboy84 wrote:
Donald2000 wrote:
This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.
Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf.

We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.
I'm not sure that's the case.

When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them?

In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?
There's no such thing as a critical list.

You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected.

You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.
Thanks for explaining.

I guess my mistake came as I compared it to say a couple whereby one is severely ill and wants to die, the partner can not assist them. I wrongly assumed that the parents in this case know the child is likely to die and are in a way assisting with his death.

My mistake and I hold my hands up to that. x
It's not a mistake - so many complex laws & rules!

Morally though, I totally agree that it's irresponsible to take the child from hospital. It's just very sad that as we're not aware of the reasons behind it that the media jump to the conclusion that the parents are monsters.

I wouldn't remove a sick child from hospital but the focus should be on finding them. Not the media using this as opportunity to cash in : )
[quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]IronLady2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sotonboy84[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Donald2000[/bold] wrote: This is such a heart rending story. On the one hand, the parents may want to spent the child's last moments with him, on the other hand the police and the doctors have a duty of care to try to save the child's life. We must not rush to judgment on this.[/p][/quote]Anybody has a right to refuse treatment and in the case of a minor, their parents make decisions on their behalf. We don't know the full circumstances surrounding this but the hospital, police and Echo certainly have made a good job at portraying the parents as criminals.[/p][/quote]I'm not sure that's the case. When someone is on the critical list, doesn't the decision go over to the Doctors as they have a duty to keep someone alive until such a time there is no further hope of saving them? In this case the parents know he will likely die without treatment and as such could potentially be charged with murder or similar?[/p][/quote]There's no such thing as a critical list. You have to give consent for any treatment, even a blood test. If you refuse treatment your decision must be respected. You may be getting confused with DNR's (Do Not Resuscitate) and ADRT's (Advance Decision to Refuse Treatment) which are measures somebody can put in place to refuse treatment if they're unable to communicate. Unless these are in place a doctor will treat a patient.[/p][/quote]Thanks for explaining. I guess my mistake came as I compared it to say a couple whereby one is severely ill and wants to die, the partner can not assist them. I wrongly assumed that the parents in this case know the child is likely to die and are in a way assisting with his death. My mistake and I hold my hands up to that. x[/p][/quote]It's not a mistake - so many complex laws & rules! Morally though, I totally agree that it's irresponsible to take the child from hospital. It's just very sad that as we're not aware of the reasons behind it that the media jump to the conclusion that the parents are monsters. I wouldn't remove a sick child from hospital but the focus should be on finding them. Not the media using this as opportunity to cash in : ) sotonboy84
  • Score: -2

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