Miliband launches Labour local election campaign in Southampton (From Daily Echo)

Can't stand this man, he's worse than Gormless Brown!

Ban him from the City!

He's got to try, but after the Blair / Brown 13 year fiasco he hasn't got a chance.
Who in their right mind would want that lot back!

"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

Of course unemployment will rise, surely you don't think a change of government will put people back to work instantly?

I gave you more credit fmg2!

It will take years to repair the damage! Labour had 13 years to make changes, they failed!

It will take another few years to repair the damage, you can't expect results over night!

What a CLOWN.......

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

Nice place Freemantle..are the pretty little fast food restaurants still there with the lively little market >> Much better than its neigbour Perth.

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

16-24 unemployment - You are wrong!
Check from around 2003/2004 and see!
>

With regard to having 2 Labour MPs. Well they have contributed to the City of Southampton just about as much as the Labour councils we had for 25 years - ZILCH!
They have absolutely nothing of any consequence to leave as a legacy to the fair citizens of the City of Southampton.

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave?

The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

You'll find that more people didn't vote for either MP at the last election than put an X for the Labour candidates.

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave?

The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess!

It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

In any event I'm voting TUSC as Southy says they're going to reduce my Council Tax!

Blimey that pigs flying again!

It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

Condor Man wrote:

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

You'll find that more people didn't vote for either MP at the last election than put an X for the Labour candidates.

Two Labour MPs.
Yeh, Dodgy Denham and the other
one who is so conspicuous by his
absence, I can't even remember his
name.

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

Agree, How many years does it take to pay off a Credit Card bill that you've maxed out?

IronLady2010 wrote:

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

Agree, How many years does it take to pay off a Credit Card bill that you've maxed out?

Well some people that I know, have
used one Credit Card to clear the debt
they have with another and so on and
so on. Well thought Iron Lady 2010.
The answer will be I'm afraid. NEVER
Let us hope that NEVER does not apply
to the country, or we really have had it.

opera phantom wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

Agree, How many years does it take to pay off a Credit Card bill that you've maxed out?

Well some people that I know, have
used one Credit Card to clear the debt
they have with another and so on and
so on. Well thought Iron Lady 2010.
The answer will be I'm afraid. NEVER
Let us hope that NEVER does not apply
to the country, or we really have had it.

You always pay off some of the debt if you keep up repayments, most of it is swallowed up in interest.

But eventually you get there! It takes years to sort out a debt that you can't afford.

Labour are scuzzbuckets for sure.

But the tories are systematically destroying the country, starting with the NHS. They are TOXIC.

So yes, I'll be voting for Labour, not because I have any affection for them, but simply because they're not as bad as the alternative.

Admittedly though, it's somewhat akin to choosing your favourite way to be disembowelled.

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave?

The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess!

It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

And taken less than 18 months to make it a damned sight worse.

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

The mess that they were saddled with was having to sort out the collapse in international banking which started in the USA, and had a world-wide domino effect.

Brown&Co bailed out the banks and building societies, otherwise morgage holders would have had their homes repossessed and savers lost their savings.

Various councils who had invested their money in Icelandic banks also had to be bailed out, otherwise they would not have been able to pay their staff.

Dodgy Dave&Co take over having criticised Labour's borrowing, but are now borrowing more than Labour ever did.

I assume that as you appear to be a fair person, as you blame Brown&Co for the 'appalling financial mess' then by the same token Dodgy Dave is responsible for the mess that the Euro is in.

The only good thing I can think to say about Ed Milliband is that the longer he is the Labour leader the likelyhood of them ever being relected remains very slim.
This gives the Conservatives a head start in any election, so please Ed stay where you are you know it makes sense

opera phantom wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

Agree, How many years does it take to pay off a Credit Card bill that you've maxed out?

Well some people that I know, have
used one Credit Card to clear the debt
they have with another and so on and
so on. Well thought Iron Lady 2010.
The answer will be I'm afraid. NEVER
Let us hope that NEVER does not apply
to the country, or we really have had it.

There seems to be a pattern emerging in 20 year patterns. We have a populist Labour government (Wilson, then Blair) which brings the country to its knees and requires a strong Tory lead to drag the nation up again. Milliband lacks the charisma of Wilson and Blair, in fact no one in the current Shadow Cabinet has one iota of personality. Looks for at least another term of Tory rule.

Condor Man wrote:

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

You'll find that more people didn't vote for either MP at the last election than put an X for the Labour candidates.

.. and, seeing they both got more votes than any other candidate, same applies to your Tories and the Lib Dems.
Own goal, me finks

freemantlegirl2 wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

Yes but the 'rise' has been sharpest under this government! Youth unemployment has been a problem for years but this government has particularly made it far worse than it had to be.

However, much as he's a 'nice fella' my heart sinks - I preferred his brother as I think he's firmer, more analytical and had more about him.

I'd like to remind those people that we have TWO Labour MPs in Southampton :) If Cameron should set foot here I think he will get a far less 'warm welcome'.... go on I dare you Dave!

Completely stupid comment, as expected. With the debt that the Labour Government left us, what will happen? A retraction in the economy? Of course there will be, the rise in the unemployment is mostly due to this. At best, blaming this Government for the present woes shows a basic understanding of what is going on in the world, at worst, crass stupidity of the first order because you are unable to separate the past truths from the present realities. Well done for your informative post. Not.

opera phantom wrote:
It was Gordon Brown, Ed Balls, and
Ed Miliband who were running the
Treasury and got this country in the
appalling financial mess that it is in.
Whether it is a government or an
individual, if you keep on borrowing
above your means, you end up in big
financial trouble, and people have to
suffer. And no, I am not a Tory I
have voted Labour all my life.
But let this bunch of clowns back in?
NO WAY

What about Darling? Darling x

I'm voitng TUSC, Southy has suggested my Council Tax will do down so we can take from those Council Estate people who have large gardens and 20 kids rather than us that choose to live in an expensive area with a small property yet pay more Council Tax!

Next time Millie comes to Southampton, we should do a whip around and get all the Bin men to go on strike, so he can see the trash Labour leave behind?

This is great! a Leader only in that position because the unions over ruled the labour party & voted him in.
The same unions who promised to do all they can to oust a Tory council but then got annoyed with him about cuts.
two city MP's one who we're only just seeing him argue for the city now he's chucking it in.
one we only hear or see close to an election? my mum like my dad were Labour but she would not vote for Whitehead wonder why?
Facts when the Tories took over the council the then Labour Government had cut our & all southern councils payments to give to Labour North.
We lost £25million just as the council took over they made cuts & believed as the South was already hit we would get off lightly.
But the new Gov was a coalition & to keep their partners happy equal amount were taken all over the country
This council tried talking to the Unions ( no chance of a deal) they put forward 5 proposals but with time running out they forced the issue.
If the unions had at any time negotiated then this could/would have been avoided.
we've had Williams come on here saying one thing the unions getting upset then a change of policy now the unions are happy?
Vote Milliband & will he be nothing better than a union puppet?
Vote Tory get in a Tory only Government & let them as usual clear up Labours mess then this time remember it was Labours mess that bought on the hard times & not vote Labour back in.twice bitten third time?

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave?

The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess!

It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing.

Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased.

Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands.

We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote:
"GETTING young people into work"

16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave?

The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess!

It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing.

Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased.

Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands.

We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

Hope Labour keep Ed Millibean, as they will have no chance at any election, local or otherwise if they do.

Ed Milliband and Ed Balls and Gordon Brown are hopelessly linked to the economic catastrophe brought about by the last labour government.

They will never be forgiven

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

I note that you do not say where the money from the big sell-off under Margaret Thatcher went.

You talk about the influx of foreign labour, but appear to forget that it was Ted Heath's Tory administration that took us into Europe WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE REFERENDUM HE POROMISED.

It is as a direct result of that action, with no thought of the consequences, that we are now faced with the situation that you are complaining about.

What is your explanation for Black Wednesday? Is that a Tory financial fiasco that you have conveniently forgotten?

What about the Poll Tax?

Another Tory gem that thought that it was fair that The Lord of the Manor should pay as much Poll Tax as the road sweeper and the postman.

That brainless scheme meant that £Millions had to be written off because of the inability to catch up with those who could not be bothered to pay, and cost of catching the few was considerably more than the money received.

For your sake, I hope that Cameron&Co stop their 'privatisation by stealth' of the NHS, because it would appear that you are in need of treatment for your Selective Memory Loss.

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

"Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incompetence of the Tory Government"

Black Wednesday affected all European countries and was primarily caused by Germany raising interests rates in order to help their unification program. Currency dealers didn't help!
>
Golden Wednesday (as it became known!) was the key to our economic revival and prosperity. The green shoots of recovery started in 1992 and by 1997 the economy was rising fast and furious. Labour inherited the best economy any new government has ever inherited.
>
The Labour government blew it! Not only did they ruin the then economy (including selling off OUR Gold!) but they created the biggest Credit Bubble and the biggest Property Bubble that was ever seen! And both Bubbles Burst!! They created the biggest spending program ever and neglected to plan for how we were going to pay for it! There is no way Labour can escape blame for those total disasters.

P.S. Don't blame the banks - the banks are a Red Herring!
The government bought shares in RBS and Lloyds TSB (money will come back when shares sold) and propped up Northern Rock (ex Building Society). People are using them to "blame all" their problems on them, including the Labour Party!
No other banks needed government money e.g. there are 500 banks in London!

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

I note that you do not say where the money from the big sell-off under Margaret Thatcher went.

You talk about the influx of foreign labour, but appear to forget that it was Ted Heath's Tory administration that took us into Europe WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE REFERENDUM HE POROMISED.

It is as a direct result of that action, with no thought of the consequences, that we are now faced with the situation that you are complaining about.

What is your explanation for Black Wednesday? Is that a Tory financial fiasco that you have conveniently forgotten?

What about the Poll Tax?

Another Tory gem that thought that it was fair that The Lord of the Manor should pay as much Poll Tax as the road sweeper and the postman.

That brainless scheme meant that £Millions had to be written off because of the inability to catch up with those who could not be bothered to pay, and cost of catching the few was considerably more than the money received.

For your sake, I hope that Cameron&Co stop their 'privatisation by stealth' of the NHS, because it would appear that you are in need of treatment for your Selective Memory Loss.

Actually I voted Labour & didn't want Maggie into power as I was convinced the unions were right but I always look at both sides & realised it was the unions who were destroying this country.
I voted alongside Tony Benn against the EEC how many anti EU people voted for joining the common market but not the EU?
Brown had a chance to give us a referendum on the Treaty but changed it's title & broke his promise.
The country seemed to want to go the way of the euro, Dyson threatened & then moved a factory abroad if we didn't join the euro we tried to keep to the European entry agreement for the Euro we were the only ones who did ( now look at it) It did not work or suit us so we pulled out of it.
Why was poll tax unfair? as you put it the Lord of the manor would send their children to private schools so saving money so exactly what extra would they use or need than some one in a council house?
there are families all grown ups are driving around in new cars & live in council houses & pay a lower tax than someone who's worked hard has an old banger but their house is in a different tax band hell the hells that fair?
Many people actually agreed with the poll tax. The ones who refused to pay should have had assets taken or been forced out of their council/private homes

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

I note that you do not say where the money from the big sell-off under Margaret Thatcher went.

You talk about the influx of foreign labour, but appear to forget that it was Ted Heath's Tory administration that took us into Europe WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE REFERENDUM HE POROMISED.

It is as a direct result of that action, with no thought of the consequences, that we are now faced with the situation that you are complaining about.

What is your explanation for Black Wednesday? Is that a Tory financial fiasco that you have conveniently forgotten?

What about the Poll Tax?

Another Tory gem that thought that it was fair that The Lord of the Manor should pay as much Poll Tax as the road sweeper and the postman.

That brainless scheme meant that £Millions had to be written off because of the inability to catch up with those who could not be bothered to pay, and cost of catching the few was considerably more than the money received.

For your sake, I hope that Cameron&Co stop their 'privatisation by stealth' of the NHS, because it would appear that you are in need of treatment for your Selective Memory Loss.

Actually I voted Labour & didn't want Maggie into power as I was convinced the unions were right but I always look at both sides & realised it was the unions who were destroying this country.
I voted alongside Tony Benn against the EEC how many anti EU people voted for joining the common market but not the EU?
Brown had a chance to give us a referendum on the Treaty but changed it's title & broke his promise.
The country seemed to want to go the way of the euro, Dyson threatened & then moved a factory abroad if we didn't join the euro we tried to keep to the European entry agreement for the Euro we were the only ones who did ( now look at it) It did not work or suit us so we pulled out of it.
Why was poll tax unfair? as you put it the Lord of the manor would send their children to private schools so saving money so exactly what extra would they use or need than some one in a council house?
there are families all grown ups are driving around in new cars & live in council houses & pay a lower tax than someone who's worked hard has an old banger but their house is in a different tax band hell the hells that fair?
Many people actually agreed with the poll tax. The ones who refused to pay should have had assets taken or been forced out of their council/private homes

Interesting.

I note that although you have been prepared to heap blame on Brown for an International banking collapse, you avoided answering my first question which was:-

What have we got to show for all the money that Thatcher's government raked in by selling off the country's assets?

You point out that Brown did not call a referendum on changes to the Treaty, but ignore the fact that it was Heath that took us in without a referendum. That was the big decision. To go in or stay out. Since then we have only had chances to tinker with the set-up.

You ask why the Poll Tax was unfair.

It was difficult and expensive to collect. The home owner was easy to get, but £millions were not collected because the authorities could not catch up with them. Here today, some place else tomorrow. My comment about the Lord of the Manor was with regard services. If the Manor House was on fire, and his gardener's cottage, on the edge of the estate, was also on fire and there was only one fire engine available, which blaze do you think it would go to?

Kids going to private schools? Well, there was tax relief to help pay for it, the same as people were given tax incentives to private health care. Those that could afford it went to their BUPA specialist, which was quicker than the NHS queue, and then the patient would be put on his list for surgery in an NHS hospital.

Where did the doctors and nurses do their training? NHS hospitals. There are NO private hospitals that have a training programme for doctors or nurses.

Where did BUPA etc get their trained staff? That's right! From the NHS.

With regard Council houses. It was not a Labour government that started the Council House sell off. It was a Thatcher idea, selling them off at considerably less than the market value, and building considerably less to replace them.

In my opinion, that should neve have been allowed. Council houses should have been let on a 10 year lease, during which time the tenants would have time to save a deposit to buy on the open market and free-up the house for another young family.

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

I note that you do not say where the money from the big sell-off under Margaret Thatcher went.

You talk about the influx of foreign labour, but appear to forget that it was Ted Heath's Tory administration that took us into Europe WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE REFERENDUM HE POROMISED.

It is as a direct result of that action, with no thought of the consequences, that we are now faced with the situation that you are complaining about.

What is your explanation for Black Wednesday? Is that a Tory financial fiasco that you have conveniently forgotten?

What about the Poll Tax?

Another Tory gem that thought that it was fair that The Lord of the Manor should pay as much Poll Tax as the road sweeper and the postman.

That brainless scheme meant that £Millions had to be written off because of the inability to catch up with those who could not be bothered to pay, and cost of catching the few was considerably more than the money received.

For your sake, I hope that Cameron&Co stop their 'privatisation by stealth' of the NHS, because it would appear that you are in need of treatment for your Selective Memory Loss.

Actually I voted Labour & didn't want Maggie into power as I was convinced the unions were right but I always look at both sides & realised it was the unions who were destroying this country.
I voted alongside Tony Benn against the EEC how many anti EU people voted for joining the common market but not the EU?
Brown had a chance to give us a referendum on the Treaty but changed it's title & broke his promise.
The country seemed to want to go the way of the euro, Dyson threatened & then moved a factory abroad if we didn't join the euro we tried to keep to the European entry agreement for the Euro we were the only ones who did ( now look at it) It did not work or suit us so we pulled out of it.
Why was poll tax unfair? as you put it the Lord of the manor would send their children to private schools so saving money so exactly what extra would they use or need than some one in a council house?
there are families all grown ups are driving around in new cars & live in council houses & pay a lower tax than someone who's worked hard has an old banger but their house is in a different tax band hell the hells that fair?
Many people actually agreed with the poll tax. The ones who refused to pay should have had assets taken or been forced out of their council/private homes

Interesting.

I note that although you have been prepared to heap blame on Brown for an International banking collapse, you avoided answering my first question which was:-

What have we got to show for all the money that Thatcher's government raked in by selling off the country's assets?

You point out that Brown did not call a referendum on changes to the Treaty, but ignore the fact that it was Heath that took us in without a referendum. That was the big decision. To go in or stay out. Since then we have only had chances to tinker with the set-up.

You ask why the Poll Tax was unfair.

It was difficult and expensive to collect. The home owner was easy to get, but £millions were not collected because the authorities could not catch up with them. Here today, some place else tomorrow. My comment about the Lord of the Manor was with regard services. If the Manor House was on fire, and his gardener's cottage, on the edge of the estate, was also on fire and there was only one fire engine available, which blaze do you think it would go to?

Kids going to private schools? Well, there was tax relief to help pay for it, the same as people were given tax incentives to private health care. Those that could afford it went to their BUPA specialist, which was quicker than the NHS queue, and then the patient would be put on his list for surgery in an NHS hospital.

Where did the doctors and nurses do their training? NHS hospitals. There are NO private hospitals that have a training programme for doctors or nurses.

Where did BUPA etc get their trained staff? That's right! From the NHS.

With regard Council houses. It was not a Labour government that started the Council House sell off. It was a Thatcher idea, selling them off at considerably less than the market value, and building considerably less to replace them.

In my opinion, that should neve have been allowed. Council houses should have been let on a 10 year lease, during which time the tenants would have time to save a deposit to buy on the open market and free-up the house for another young family.

if you noticed I said I voted against the common market.Ted Heath took us into the Common Market not into the European union which the treaty that Brown signed & lied to us about. Ed Milliband wants to take us further in so hows he different than the Liberals?
we've lost our law making to the EU

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

loosehead wrote:

Linesman wrote:

senseofsouthampton wrote:

Linesman wrote:

IronLady2010 wrote:

Linesman wrote:

George4th wrote: "GETTING young people into work" 16-24 unemployment doubled under Labour!!!!!!

And you think that the situation has improved under Dodgy Dave? The national unemployment figures are the highest since the Tories were last in power.

You try turning around unemployment in a year or two! Don't forget it took 13 years to create this mess! It will take a fair few years to get us back on our feet, but GREAT Britain will do it! Unless Labour get back in power.....

What you appear to be ignoring is the FACT that under Dodgy Dave&Co, we are still Borrowing. Despite all of the cuts made and the number that have been made unemployed and found that they have had their benefits cut, the National Debt has increased. Dodgy Dave got elected on a promise that he would cut borrowing and that the NHS was safe in his hands. We now have massive debts, that are increasing on a daily basis, and the prospect of having Doctors required to be Accountants instead of tending the sick, as part of the privatisation of the NHS.

What a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics your answer shows.
.
Of course borrowing goes up in a recession - whatever the cause of it. The last government's error was to wilfully spend more than it received during 10 years of debt fuelled growth. Meaning we went into the down turn already spending more than we received - a gap that can only get bigger when tax receipts fall and unemployment goes up.
.
This is unquestionably the fault of brown and co. The roof could so easily have been fixed while the sun shone.
.
As for the NHS, the reforms brought in by Hewitt when she was health secretary did far more to introduce market forces to the NHS than these reforms will ever do. But why let the truth get in the way of an uninformed rant.

But the borrowing is being used to pay benefits to people that they have put out of work.

My knowledge of economics tells me that we have nothing to show for all the money raised by selling off national assets, under successive Tory Governments.

It was not put into a hospital and school building programme, nor did it see new prisons being built to cater with the overcrowding.

Of course, Black Wednesday happened on 16 September 1992, when the Tories practically bankrupted the country overnight. That only left them with British Coal and British Rail to sell off in 1995 and 1996.

The problems that Brown&Co had to face were not of his making, but a crisis in International Banking that had it's beginnings in the USA.

Black Wednesday was a Financial Disaster that can be blamed on nobody except the incomptence of the Tory Government of the time, which had the knock-on effect of interest rates in their teens and record numbers of people who had their homes repossessed.

You could be right, I may have a chronic misunderstanding of the very basics of economics, but I do have an understanding of the effects that Black Wednesday had on the country, whose fault it was and who suffered the most from its effects.

Now, my economic genius friend, perhaps you would enlighten me and let me know what the country has to show for the money raised by selling off British Aerospace, Cable&Wireless, North Sea Oil, BT, British Gas, British Airways, British Steel and the Water Utilities that took place between 1981 and 1989?

Maybe the billions spent on invalidity pay & social security payments to people who are not disables or invalid .
To the people even before 3 million Eastern Europeans came here & all found work yet we have 2-3million people on the dole with at least half that number having no intention of finding work & quite happy falsely claiming benefits they're not entitled to.
Labour new the welfare system & health service were broke & not being used for the reasons they were created
they said they would fix both they backed out of fixing both why?
they new with the mess they had left the economy in with the increasing unemployment levels due to Brown's folly of allowing in the Eastern Europeans straight away( no other country would) & not sorting out welfare payments.
they had to gain votes or it would be a walk in the park for the Tories.
So they offered the earth to get votes knowing they would have to make huge cuts.
They went on arms procurements even though they knew we couldn't afford them & could have waited & used a perfectly good aircraft carrier.
But they wanted Pompey votes.
what ever way you look at it before Maggie before Cameron Labours left this country up the creek without a paddle leaving it to the Tories to bail us out & take the venom from the people who know it has to happen but don't like it

I note that you do not say where the money from the big sell-off under Margaret Thatcher went.

You talk about the influx of foreign labour, but appear to forget that it was Ted Heath's Tory administration that took us into Europe WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE REFERENDUM HE POROMISED.

It is as a direct result of that action, with no thought of the consequences, that we are now faced with the situation that you are complaining about.

What is your explanation for Black Wednesday? Is that a Tory financial fiasco that you have conveniently forgotten?

What about the Poll Tax?

Another Tory gem that thought that it was fair that The Lord of the Manor should pay as much Poll Tax as the road sweeper and the postman.

That brainless scheme meant that £Millions had to be written off because of the inability to catch up with those who could not be bothered to pay, and cost of catching the few was considerably more than the money received.

For your sake, I hope that Cameron&Co stop their 'privatisation by stealth' of the NHS, because it would appear that you are in need of treatment for your Selective Memory Loss.

Actually I voted Labour & didn't want Maggie into power as I was convinced the unions were right but I always look at both sides & realised it was the unions who were destroying this country.
I voted alongside Tony Benn against the EEC how many anti EU people voted for joining the common market but not the EU?
Brown had a chance to give us a referendum on the Treaty but changed it's title & broke his promise.
The country seemed to want to go the way of the euro, Dyson threatened & then moved a factory abroad if we didn't join the euro we tried to keep to the European entry agreement for the Euro we were the only ones who did ( now look at it) It did not work or suit us so we pulled out of it.
Why was poll tax unfair? as you put it the Lord of the manor would send their children to private schools so saving money so exactly what extra would they use or need than some one in a council house?
there are families all grown ups are driving around in new cars & live in council houses & pay a lower tax than someone who's worked hard has an old banger but their house is in a different tax band hell the hells that fair?
Many people actually agreed with the poll tax. The ones who refused to pay should have had assets taken or been forced out of their council/private homes

Interesting.

I note that although you have been prepared to heap blame on Brown for an International banking collapse, you avoided answering my first question which was:-

What have we got to show for all the money that Thatcher's government raked in by selling off the country's assets?

You point out that Brown did not call a referendum on changes to the Treaty, but ignore the fact that it was Heath that took us in without a referendum. That was the big decision. To go in or stay out. Since then we have only had chances to tinker with the set-up.

You ask why the Poll Tax was unfair.

It was difficult and expensive to collect. The home owner was easy to get, but £millions were not collected because the authorities could not catch up with them. Here today, some place else tomorrow. My comment about the Lord of the Manor was with regard services. If the Manor House was on fire, and his gardener's cottage, on the edge of the estate, was also on fire and there was only one fire engine available, which blaze do you think it would go to?

Kids going to private schools? Well, there was tax relief to help pay for it, the same as people were given tax incentives to private health care. Those that could afford it went to their BUPA specialist, which was quicker than the NHS queue, and then the patient would be put on his list for surgery in an NHS hospital.

Where did the doctors and nurses do their training? NHS hospitals. There are NO private hospitals that have a training programme for doctors or nurses.

Where did BUPA etc get their trained staff? That's right! From the NHS.

With regard Council houses. It was not a Labour government that started the Council House sell off. It was a Thatcher idea, selling them off at considerably less than the market value, and building considerably less to replace them.

In my opinion, that should neve have been allowed. Council houses should have been let on a 10 year lease, during which time the tenants would have time to save a deposit to buy on the open market and free-up the house for another young family.

if you noticed I said I voted against the common market.Ted Heath took us into the Common Market not into the European union which the treaty that Brown signed & lied to us about. Ed Milliband wants to take us further in so hows he different than the Liberals?
we've lost our law making to the EU

Strange as it may seem, I voted to stay in, but if the vote had been given Before the decision was taken, then I would have been against.

The problem, as I see it, is that the longer we are in, the more difficult and expensive it would be to get out, and that is why the step to be in the EU was virtually forced upon us.

How do I reach that conclusion? The EU is our largest trading area. Going into the Common Market made it more difficult to trade with our long-term trading partners, and they no longer look to us as preferential customers.

We lost a lot of control over our laws before the step to the EU. Joining the Common Market saw the free movement of labour throughout the area. That was the 'toe in the door' and cannot be laid at Labour's door.