Hospital forced to write off £250,000

Daily Echo: Foreign patients not paying hospital bills Foreign patients not paying hospital bills

Southampton hospital bosses wrote off more than a quarter of a million pounds last year after treating foreign patients who left without settling their bills.

Figures released in Parliament show Southampton University Hospitals Trust wrote off or abandoned claims for £253,000 in 2011.

The trust, which needs to save £100 million by 2015, is also owed almost £500,000 in unpaid bills going back even further.

Bosses have said foreign patients who were “unwilling or unable” to pay would only receive treatment if it was urgent.

But Chris Skidmore, the MP who compiled the figures, said: “The NHS is a national health service, not an international one.”

The Tory MP is campaigning to change the law so that more can be done to secure payment before treatment starts.

Unless their country has a reciprocal arrangement with the UK foreign nationals are required to pay for any non-emergency NHS treatment they receive.

Winchester and Eastleigh NHS Trust, now part of Hampshire Hospitals Foundation Trust, that runs the Royal Hampshire County Hospital, Winchester, said it had received £218,000 from foreign patients in 2010/11, and had not written off any bad debts.

It is estimated that across the country the NHS is owed £40 million, with £14 million written off by health trusts last year.

Payment is usually raised with foreign patients when they are admitted to hospital, but in some cases, for example if they are in a coma, this is impossible.

Southampton University Hospitals Trust said: “We are one of the largest acute hospital trusts in the country and ensuring those who require emergency treatment have access to it immediately is our highest priority.

“Patients we treat who are not resident in the UK and therefore not entitled to free NHS treatment will be charged for any treatment they receive away from the emergency department.

!If they are unwilling or unable to pay, they receive only the treatment that is immediately necessary.”

Comments (74)

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7:37am Thu 2 Aug 12

Huey says...

Surrender passport on admission?
Surrender passport on admission? Huey

7:40am Thu 2 Aug 12

News Fanatic says...

If someone is seriously ill and has no insurance and no money, what do you do? Turn them out on the streets to die? Even the US hospitals lose money as a result of the sick being unable to pay their bills.
If someone is seriously ill and has no insurance and no money, what do you do? Turn them out on the streets to die? Even the US hospitals lose money as a result of the sick being unable to pay their bills. News Fanatic

7:52am Thu 2 Aug 12

News Fanatic says...

Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
It's easy enough to get another.
[quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]It's easy enough to get another. News Fanatic

7:58am Thu 2 Aug 12

Ant Smoking MP says...

Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!! Ant Smoking MP

8:04am Thu 2 Aug 12

Higginz says...

I'd suggest the invention of some kind of tiny explosive device which is set to locally detonate at some point within twenty-eight days of its being inserted in to patients who have been treated but have been unable to pay. Only upon full payment would the device be switched off. However this is an absurd suggestion, as it would result in much gruesomeness at the point of detontation and crime to fund the payment, so I'm not even sure why you brought it up in the first place.
I'd suggest the invention of some kind of tiny explosive device which is set to locally detonate at some point within twenty-eight days of its being inserted in to patients who have been treated but have been unable to pay. Only upon full payment would the device be switched off. However this is an absurd suggestion, as it would result in much gruesomeness at the point of detontation and crime to fund the payment, so I'm not even sure why you brought it up in the first place. Higginz

8:31am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country. Georgem

8:31am Thu 2 Aug 12

Taskforce 141 says...

The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment! Taskforce 141

8:35am Thu 2 Aug 12

good-gosh says...

I would cover the loss in each year to the bills for treatment in the next year.
I would cover the loss in each year to the bills for treatment in the next year. good-gosh

8:52am Thu 2 Aug 12

The Watcher says...

Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL.
.
I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment.
.
That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals.
.
These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant.
[quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL. . I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment. . That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals. . These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant. The Watcher

9:09am Thu 2 Aug 12

solomum says...

Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate.
[quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate. solomum

9:15am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

I firmly believe the Echo uses dice to decide what to report on. For example, there is a die which has the words ''suggest corruption amongst', 'imply unfair advantages in favour of', 'demonstrate how the taxpayer is ripped off by', 'blame decay of society on', 'call into question the usefulness of' and 'manipulate statistics to incite hatred of' on each of it's six sides, and another which has the words 'students', 'foreigners', 'the unemployed', 'bankers', 'taxi drivers' and 'politicians' on each of its six sides.

"Today I am going to write a story that will ... demonstrate how the taxpayer is ripped off by ... foreigners!"
I firmly believe the Echo uses dice to decide what to report on. For example, there is a die which has the words ''suggest corruption amongst', 'imply unfair advantages in favour of', 'demonstrate how the taxpayer is ripped off by', 'blame decay of society on', 'call into question the usefulness of' and 'manipulate statistics to incite hatred of' on each of it's six sides, and another which has the words 'students', 'foreigners', 'the unemployed', 'bankers', 'taxi drivers' and 'politicians' on each of its six sides. "Today I am going to write a story that will ... demonstrate how the taxpayer is ripped off by ... foreigners!" Georgem

9:26am Thu 2 Aug 12

elvisimo says...

Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
I dont think this article is about illegal immigrants. It applies to foreign visitors, of all types who use our health service and then dissapear.

If it were the cost for the uk would be much higher than that of the likes of Sweden. - Sweden has between 80 - 100,000 illegal imigrants and we have anything up to 600,000.
Sweden have offered the same health care to immigrants up to the age of 18 and subsidised healthcare for urgent medical conditions for those over 18.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]I dont think this article is about illegal immigrants. It applies to foreign visitors, of all types who use our health service and then dissapear. If it were the cost for the uk would be much higher than that of the likes of Sweden. - Sweden has between 80 - 100,000 illegal imigrants and we have anything up to 600,000. Sweden have offered the same health care to immigrants up to the age of 18 and subsidised healthcare for urgent medical conditions for those over 18. elvisimo

9:29am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

elvisimo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
I dont think this article is about illegal immigrants. It applies to foreign visitors, of all types who use our health service and then dissapear.

If it were the cost for the uk would be much higher than that of the likes of Sweden. - Sweden has between 80 - 100,000 illegal imigrants and we have anything up to 600,000.
Sweden have offered the same health care to immigrants up to the age of 18 and subsidised healthcare for urgent medical conditions for those over 18.
Yep, good point. The evil Echo manipulated me into assuming "illegal immigrants"! Thanks for the correction.
[quote][p][bold]elvisimo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]I dont think this article is about illegal immigrants. It applies to foreign visitors, of all types who use our health service and then dissapear. If it were the cost for the uk would be much higher than that of the likes of Sweden. - Sweden has between 80 - 100,000 illegal imigrants and we have anything up to 600,000. Sweden have offered the same health care to immigrants up to the age of 18 and subsidised healthcare for urgent medical conditions for those over 18.[/p][/quote]Yep, good point. The evil Echo manipulated me into assuming "illegal immigrants"! Thanks for the correction. Georgem

9:30am Thu 2 Aug 12

Linesman says...

Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
[quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays. Linesman

9:37am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
[quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay. Georgem

9:44am Thu 2 Aug 12

bigfella777 says...

What sort of treatment would we get in a foreign country? If your on holiday even if you have insurance you have to pay first and then claim the costs back yourself.
We are part of Europe so lets have the same rules as the rest of the member states.
What sort of treatment would we get in a foreign country? If your on holiday even if you have insurance you have to pay first and then claim the costs back yourself. We are part of Europe so lets have the same rules as the rest of the member states. bigfella777

9:44am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

Georgem wrote:
Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay.[/p][/quote]How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country? hulla baloo

9:47am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital.
I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital. hulla baloo

9:50am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?
Not my problem.

(hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay.[/p][/quote]How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?[/p][/quote]Not my problem. (hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers) Georgem

9:50am Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

hulla baloo wrote:
I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital.
Or perhaps deduct it from the foreign aid we are sending these countries way.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital.[/p][/quote]Or perhaps deduct it from the foreign aid we are sending these countries way. Shoong

9:55am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?
Not my problem.

(hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)
It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue?
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay.[/p][/quote]How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?[/p][/quote]Not my problem. (hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)[/p][/quote]It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue? hulla baloo

9:59am Thu 2 Aug 12

G0Rf says...

A lot of sick and ill foreigners come here on holiday just to get treatment for free.
Then they change their name and enrol on the asylum / child benefit / housing benefit or what ever else they can get for free....
all the while we go to work and pay for it through evere rising taxes

what a nice country we live in
A lot of sick and ill foreigners come here on holiday just to get treatment for free. Then they change their name and enrol on the asylum / child benefit / housing benefit or what ever else they can get for free.... all the while we go to work and pay for it through evere rising taxes what a nice country we live in G0Rf

9:59am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital.
You mean, something like the European Health Insurance Card, that replaced the old E1-11 etc? Yeh, that might be interesting.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: I would think a system could be in place that all the 'health tourists' that come here, along with foreign nationals that need emergency health care, and not in a position to pay, then the bills are sent to their respective embassies in this country. As for illegals with no visa, give them basic care and deport upon leaving hospital.[/p][/quote]You mean, something like the European Health Insurance Card, that replaced the old E1-11 etc? Yeh, that might be interesting. Georgem

10:00am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?
Not my problem.

(hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)
It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue?
*sigh* re-read the post, and come back when you understand it.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay.[/p][/quote]How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?[/p][/quote]Not my problem. (hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)[/p][/quote]It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue?[/p][/quote]*sigh* re-read the post, and come back when you understand it. Georgem

10:02am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
[quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector. southy

10:03am Thu 2 Aug 12

Torchie1 says...

solomum wrote:
Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate.
The 'others' are quite fortunate knowing that the UK is the land of milk and honey to those who want rights without responsibilities.
[quote][p][bold]solomum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate.[/p][/quote]The 'others' are quite fortunate knowing that the UK is the land of milk and honey to those who want rights without responsibilities. Torchie1

10:06am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza. Georgem

10:08am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2. southy

10:10am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.
I don't care.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.[/p][/quote]I don't care. Georgem

10:13am Thu 2 Aug 12

Richard 51 says...

All British people have a national insurance number, no insurance number then you have to pay and seeing the national insurance numbers all have a data base on computer just link it up to the hospital
All British people have a national insurance number, no insurance number then you have to pay and seeing the national insurance numbers all have a data base on computer just link it up to the hospital Richard 51

10:18am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

How many Brits carry or know their N.I.number? And that still does not solve the issue of HOW to make others pay.
How many Brits carry or know their N.I.number? And that still does not solve the issue of HOW to make others pay. hulla baloo

10:19am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Linesman wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
Which means they would not be able to leave the country.

Do you think that they would be

a) Left to starve to death or do you think that

b) They would be taken care of by the state?

If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals?

if b) The tax-payer pays.
Simple. We MAKE them pay.
How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?
Not my problem.

(hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)
It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue?
*sigh* re-read the post, and come back when you understand it.
Please enlighten me on what you think I do, or do not understand.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Linesman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]Which means they would not be able to leave the country. Do you think that they would be a) Left to starve to death or do you think that b) They would be taken care of by the state? If a) Who do you think would pay for their funerals? if b) The tax-payer pays.[/p][/quote]Simple. We MAKE them pay.[/p][/quote]How do you propose to do that if they have no money or assets in this country?[/p][/quote]Not my problem. (hint: I know we can't make them pay. I'm pre-empting the inevitable poorly thought-out answers)[/p][/quote]It is your ( and our problem) if there are money shortages, and longer waiting lists for genuine citizens of this country. How would you feel if your long awaited operation keeps getting cancelled because foreigners/illegals jump the queue?[/p][/quote]*sigh* re-read the post, and come back when you understand it.[/p][/quote]Please enlighten me on what you think I do, or do not understand. hulla baloo

10:25am Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
If you go and actually read the story, there is no mention of immigrants.

This is about 'health tourists' but it's no surprise that you've managed to get out the soap box for your daily lashings of good old fashioned outdated Trotsky propaganda.

'run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system' WTF are you on about? NHS? World wide system? Dear oh dear.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]If you go and actually read the story, there is no mention of immigrants. This is about 'health tourists' but it's no surprise that you've managed to get out the soap box for your daily lashings of good old fashioned outdated Trotsky propaganda. 'run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system' WTF are you on about? NHS? World wide system? Dear oh dear. Shoong

10:29am Thu 2 Aug 12

sarfhamton says...

250K? that is nothing, the NHS wastes millions patching up work shy english born scum everyday. At least most people that come to this country have a good work ethic!
250K? that is nothing, the NHS wastes millions patching up work shy english born scum everyday. At least most people that come to this country have a good work ethic! sarfhamton

10:32am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that? hulla baloo

10:35am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?[/p][/quote]Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS. Georgem

10:39am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.
Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on.
The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.[/p][/quote]Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on. The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients southy

10:40am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.
Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on.
The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients
When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.[/p][/quote]Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on. The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients[/p][/quote]When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda. Georgem

10:42am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.
But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?[/p][/quote]Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.[/p][/quote]But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue? hulla baloo

10:49am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.
I don't care.
Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.[/p][/quote]I don't care.[/p][/quote]Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working. southy

10:55am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.
But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?
The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?[/p][/quote]Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.[/p][/quote]But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?[/p][/quote]The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk. Georgem

10:55am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.
Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on.
The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients
When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda.
No its not It just telling you what is really going, things started to go wrong in this country ever since we went 100% Capitalism and that started in 1979.
Its Propaganda when what is really happening is hiden and a different picture is painted, thats whats beeing going on now for 30 years, a different picture being painted to cover up what is really going on and the cause of it, and its Capitalism that is the cause of it.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.[/p][/quote]Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on. The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients[/p][/quote]When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda.[/p][/quote]No its not It just telling you what is really going, things started to go wrong in this country ever since we went 100% Capitalism and that started in 1979. Its Propaganda when what is really happening is hiden and a different picture is painted, thats whats beeing going on now for 30 years, a different picture being painted to cover up what is really going on and the cause of it, and its Capitalism that is the cause of it. southy

10:55am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.
I don't care.
Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working.
I Do care about the system. I just don't care about your endless inane ramblings.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.[/p][/quote]I don't care.[/p][/quote]Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working.[/p][/quote]I Do care about the system. I just don't care about your endless inane ramblings. Georgem

10:57am Thu 2 Aug 12

hulla baloo says...

Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.
But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?
The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk.
I agree, so invoice them afterwards, or are you happy to pay for breasts for another man ( or woman) to enjoy? ;)
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?[/p][/quote]Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.[/p][/quote]But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?[/p][/quote]The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk.[/p][/quote]I agree, so invoice them afterwards, or are you happy to pay for breasts for another man ( or woman) to enjoy? ;) hulla baloo

11:03am Thu 2 Aug 12

St Retford says...

The Watcher wrote:
Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL.
.
I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment.
.
That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals.
.
These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant.
Indeed.

Taskforce does, however, win £5 for being the first caller today to use the word "disgraceful". There are still prizes to be won for "soft touch", "send them all back" and "supposed to be a christian country".
[quote][p][bold]The Watcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL. . I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment. . That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals. . These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant.[/p][/quote]Indeed. Taskforce does, however, win £5 for being the first caller today to use the word "disgraceful". There are still prizes to be won for "soft touch", "send them all back" and "supposed to be a christian country". St Retford

11:04am Thu 2 Aug 12

Torchie1 says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.
Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.
I don't care.
Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working.
I Do care about the system. I just don't care about your endless inane ramblings.
Only the other day we were treated to an inane diatribe about Stalin being a communist capitalist. We can only wonder about the reaction in the Council, Chamber if the poor befuddled old rambler had found enough idiots to vote him in.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: Sweden recently DECIDED to grant illegal immigrants the same health care as nationals. Say what you like about our Scandinavian friends, they know how to run a country.[/p][/quote]Theres a lot of Socialism Policys in Sweden, There political policy is the one that Thatcher replace in 1979, up to the end of the Labour Government in 1979 we had a Keynsain economics and political policy, (this is what Sweden still as in place), Thatcher change that to Neo-Liberbalism and Neo-Nationalism the same as we had before 1945, the failed system of the 1920's and 1930's that lead us to world war 2.[/p][/quote]I don't care.[/p][/quote]Well you should care the Economic and Political system matters alot, it the way things are run. More so when you praise another Country system with out knowing the reason why it is working.[/p][/quote]I Do care about the system. I just don't care about your endless inane ramblings.[/p][/quote]Only the other day we were treated to an inane diatribe about Stalin being a communist capitalist. We can only wonder about the reaction in the Council, Chamber if the poor befuddled old rambler had found enough idiots to vote him in. Torchie1

11:05am Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Ant Smoking MP wrote:
Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish?
.
Its just not cricket!!
Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter,
I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later.
The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.
Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.
Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on.
The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients
When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda.
No its not It just telling you what is really going, things started to go wrong in this country ever since we went 100% Capitalism and that started in 1979.
Its Propaganda when what is really happening is hiden and a different picture is painted, thats whats beeing going on now for 30 years, a different picture being painted to cover up what is really going on and the cause of it, and its Capitalism that is the cause of it.
It's OK Peter, we understand that you need the attention.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ant Smoking MP[/bold] wrote: Hang on a minute!! I thought according to the Daily Mail, Sun, Express, Star and assorted right wing Tory nuts ,"Johnny Foreigner" was claiming benefits to use the NHS or is this legend just the usual right wing rubbish? . Its just not cricket!![/p][/quote]Yes I know, its been the Right wing aka the Capitalist lot who have been painting this false picture for years, just to keep people diveded, So they can blame the immigrants and keep they mind diverted for the real truth and the real matter, I been telling people this is not the case for a very long time, and all I got was I was talking rubbish ect, and like I said before I have time on my Socialist side for articals like this to come up sooner or later. The NHS was intended to be a untied international one, but with only countrys with the same sort of system, Health Insurence hate these sort of Helath Services because they can't make money, not even when you go aboard if this system was world wide, and is one of the reasons why they are out to run the NHS down and stop it from becoming a world wide system, for every over seas person that had to use our health system for an emergency would end up going back to there country and start telling others, and would start wanting there country to have the same system, and this was working up the 1980's, when the run down of the NHS started and bits where started to be sold off to the private sector.[/p][/quote]Give it a rest, southy. Not everyone wants every story turned into some anti-capitalist propaganda extravaganza.[/p][/quote]Its not Propaganda at all, its what is really going on. The main real reason why we have a long waiting list and people operations being cancelled- Its because of Private Health Care and not just from the UK, Private Health Care from all round the world, Private Health care cue jumps the NHS patients cues and comes first in NHS sevices, Private Health Care should use there own Hospitals, Staff, beds and gear or join the waiting list with all the other NHS patients[/p][/quote]When your every post contains a slagging off of "right wing capitalists" it most definitely IS propaganda.[/p][/quote]No its not It just telling you what is really going, things started to go wrong in this country ever since we went 100% Capitalism and that started in 1979. Its Propaganda when what is really happening is hiden and a different picture is painted, thats whats beeing going on now for 30 years, a different picture being painted to cover up what is really going on and the cause of it, and its Capitalism that is the cause of it.[/p][/quote]It's OK Peter, we understand that you need the attention. Shoong

11:06am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
Georgem wrote:
hulla baloo wrote:
And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?
Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.
But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?
The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk.
I agree, so invoice them afterwards, or are you happy to pay for breasts for another man ( or woman) to enjoy? ;)
I don't care. I understand what 'socialised health care' means.
[quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hulla baloo[/bold] wrote: And while we are on the topic, why should the NHS pick up the tab for vanity operations like private boob jobs that went wrong? Wonder what the figures ( no pun intended) are for that?[/p][/quote]Why SHOULDN'T they? It's no different to picking up the tab for a skiing accident. Once we start saying "No, I don't think you're entitled to the health care you've paid for" it's no longer an NHS.[/p][/quote]But if you have a private operation for vanity and personal reasons, not health or life threatening, why should that become an NHS issue?[/p][/quote]The botched implants ARE life threatening. Why they were done is irrelevant, the fact is, the recipient's health is at risk.[/p][/quote]I agree, so invoice them afterwards, or are you happy to pay for breasts for another man ( or woman) to enjoy? ;)[/p][/quote]I don't care. I understand what 'socialised health care' means. Georgem

11:12am Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care southy

11:28am Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate. Shoong

11:29am Thu 2 Aug 12

Condor Man says...

If foreign nationals are paying National Insurance they should be entitled to NHS care. If they aren't they should have insurance to cover it.
If foreign nationals are paying National Insurance they should be entitled to NHS care. If they aren't they should have insurance to cover it. Condor Man

11:30am Thu 2 Aug 12

acid drop says...

Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
if no passport to surrender then no treatment except the bare minimum
[quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]if no passport to surrender then no treatment except the bare minimum acid drop

11:44am Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
You obviously didn't read the bit that said "except southy".
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]You obviously didn't read the bit that said "except southy". Georgem

12:56pm Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets. southy

12:57pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Taskforce 141 says...

The Watcher wrote:
Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL.
.
I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment.
.
That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals.
.
These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant.
No, they dont come here to have an accident they come here for treatment - please try reading!!
[quote][p][bold]The Watcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]Methinks you don't really understand the problem here. LOL. . I very much doubt someone travels to this country to have a serious accident & then require emergency treatment. . That would be some dedication just to be admitted to our fine NHS hospitals. . These people are not having hip or knee replacements, etc, but don't let that get in the way of a knee jerk rant.[/p][/quote]No, they dont come here to have an accident they come here for treatment - please try reading!! Taskforce 141

12:59pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Taskforce 141 says...

solomum wrote:
Taskforce 141 wrote:
The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother.

Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment!
If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate.
Totally agree, if i lived in a country where i could 't afford health care i would travel to where it was free - thats survival instincts. But i dont live in a foreign country, i live in the UK and the NHS is almost at breaking point - then we will all lose!
[quote][p][bold]solomum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Taskforce 141[/bold] wrote: The fact that people travel to the UK simply to visit a hospital and get free treatment suggests that this a wide spread problem and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. It's disgraceful especially when I know of British people having to wait months and in some cases years to receive the hospital appointment they need, but any tom, dick and harry from any other country seem to get in and out without little bother. Sort it out before the NHS collapses and we will all be on the street without treatment![/p][/quote]If you were in need of treatment to save your life, you could not afford it in your country and you knew it was free in another country, would you not travel there to get the treatment? Health is not a luxury, but a basic human need and people will do what they need to in order to get access to quality health care. We are fortunate to live in a country where health care is at our disposal. Others are not so fortunate.[/p][/quote]Totally agree, if i lived in a country where i could 't afford health care i would travel to where it was free - thats survival instincts. But i dont live in a foreign country, i live in the UK and the NHS is almost at breaking point - then we will all lose! Taskforce 141

1:02pm Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

acid drop wrote:
Huey wrote:
Surrender passport on admission?
if no passport to surrender then no treatment except the bare minimum
The problem here is overseas Private Health Insurance, the book the operation and then not pay for it for some reason or another.
[quote][p][bold]acid drop[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Huey[/bold] wrote: Surrender passport on admission?[/p][/quote]if no passport to surrender then no treatment except the bare minimum[/p][/quote]The problem here is overseas Private Health Insurance, the book the operation and then not pay for it for some reason or another. southy

1:05pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you.

Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.[/p][/quote]No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you. Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable. Georgem

1:09pm Thu 2 Aug 12

ju_ju68 says...

the above arguments aside, it seems to me that if Winchester hospital can collect money from their foreign patients, how come Southampton can't?
I realise Southampton is a bigger hospital, but it also has many more managers and staff, who's job is to sort out these kind of problems.
the above arguments aside, it seems to me that if Winchester hospital can collect money from their foreign patients, how come Southampton can't? I realise Southampton is a bigger hospital, but it also has many more managers and staff, who's job is to sort out these kind of problems. ju_ju68

1:32pm Thu 2 Aug 12

good-gosh says...

ju_ju68 wrote:
the above arguments aside, it seems to me that if Winchester hospital can collect money from their foreign patients, how come Southampton can't?
I realise Southampton is a bigger hospital, but it also has many more managers and staff, who's job is to sort out these kind of problems.
There would be no point in spending more time on obvious refusals to pay. The remedy is to charge future visitors a little more this year and next, to cover the loss from those who didn’t pay last year. Costs lost this year can be added to next year's charges, and so on, thereby always adding a surcharge to cover previous defaults.
[quote][p][bold]ju_ju68[/bold] wrote: the above arguments aside, it seems to me that if Winchester hospital can collect money from their foreign patients, how come Southampton can't? I realise Southampton is a bigger hospital, but it also has many more managers and staff, who's job is to sort out these kind of problems.[/p][/quote]There would be no point in spending more time on obvious refusals to pay. The remedy is to charge future visitors a little more this year and next, to cover the loss from those who didn’t pay last year. Costs lost this year can be added to next year's charges, and so on, thereby always adding a surcharge to cover previous defaults. good-gosh

2:01pm Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you.

Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.
Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed.
Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.[/p][/quote]No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you. Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.[/p][/quote]Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed. Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years. southy

2:46pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you.

Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.
Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed.
Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.
The defence rests.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.[/p][/quote]No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you. Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.[/p][/quote]Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed. Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.[/p][/quote]The defence rests. Georgem

2:54pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you.

Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.
Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed.
Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.
Most adults know when to can it when they've made a complete idiot of themselves.

It's never too late to learn new skills.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.[/p][/quote]No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you. Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.[/p][/quote]Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed. Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.[/p][/quote]Most adults know when to can it when they've made a complete idiot of themselves. It's never too late to learn new skills. Shoong

2:57pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care
You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off.

Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions'

To a tee mate.
But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look.
You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked.
When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.
No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you.

Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.
Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed.
Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.
Most adults know when to can it when they've made a complete idiot of themselves.

It's never too late to learn new skills.
Something something capitalist pig-dog blah blah far right blah blah trotsky had a twelve inch dong blah blah something about socialism.
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Shoong do I need to do and A,B,C. to explain, or is it not obvious that any country that has a close health system like ours what happens. Like Georgem pointed out Sweden Health System is close to what we got, you can go to Sweden with out the need to pay out or worry that you have no cover if you fall ill, the Uk as agreement with Countrys like Sweden over Health matters that people can travel to each other countrys and not need health insurence, this is what was trying to be done, a type of world wide Health Care where you can travel and not worry about if your covered in medical care[/p][/quote]You don't need to explain poppycock to me, I can see it a mile off. Propaganda, Definition - 'information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions' To a tee mate.[/p][/quote]But you miss the most important part its Capitalism that as 100% Control of the system as been now for 32 years and for them to keep it that way, they got to keep the false propaganda going, And I only telling what is, and what is going on that is not propaganda, Propaganda is used when your trying to hide some thing, and that is not what I am doing, I am giving information that people often over look. You your self Shoong as been one of those that have blamed immigration for the state of the Health service of being over worked. When in reality its where the private health system have been leaching on the NHS, plus the government starving it of the cash that is needed, just so the private sector can fill its pockets.[/p][/quote]No, southy, you missed the important part that is the actual words Shoong typed. No matter what someone posts, your response only bears relevance to it by coincidence at best. You have a list of responses you wish to give, and give them whenever you find a post addressed to you. Explain how you posting propaganda is a response to Shoong defining propaganda. Answers in either English or Sikh are acceptable.[/p][/quote]Propaganda is used in many ways, like highliting the working parts and not the parts that fail, or the other way round, it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda, by blaming a group that is not responable, like in this case the poor sevice in the NHS is due to immigration, how many years have it been now that the Capitalist have been blaming immigration on poor NHS service and that they taking up all the Jobs, when deliberity missing out the really reason why, like on this artical its private Health Care from overseas not paying there bill to the NHS, or jobs the real reason is industary was destoried in the 80's, so there is no more real jobs for people, you complain about people claiming unemployment benefit, but will not blame the real people who made them unployed. Go a lot deeper go pass the smoke screens and mirrors of Capitalism propaganda, and you will start to see the real reasons, and not the false image that being put up. that is what propaganda is a false image. Capitalist are very good at that they all ways have been, but then again they been doing it for 1000's of years.[/p][/quote]Most adults know when to can it when they've made a complete idiot of themselves. It's never too late to learn new skills.[/p][/quote]Something something capitalist pig-dog blah blah far right blah blah trotsky had a twelve inch dong blah blah something about socialism. Georgem

3:19pm Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish. southy

3:29pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Shoong says...

southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite.

With evidence.

Good enough answer?
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite. With evidence. Good enough answer? Shoong

3:33pm Thu 2 Aug 12

freefinker says...

Thatcher this.
Blah, blah, blah.
Thatcher that.
Blah, blah, blah.
1979.
Blah, blah, blah.
Right wing.
Blah, blah, blah.
aka.
Blah, blah, blah.
Capitalist.
Blah, blah, blah.
Economic and Political.
Blah, blah, blah.
Failed system.
Blah, blah, blah.
False picture.
Blah, blah, blah.
Communist capitalist.
Blah, blah, blah.
100% Capitalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Neo-Liberalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Neo-Nationalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Not propaganda.
Blah, blah, blah.
False propaganda.
Blah, blah, blah.
Private sector can fill its pockets.
Blah, blah, blah.
Hidden agenda.
Blah, blah, blah.
No more real jobs for people.
Blah, blah, blah.
False image that being put up.
Blah, blah, blah.
100% control of the system.
Blah, blah, blah.
Now for 32 years.
Blah, blah, blah.
I am giving information that people often overlook.
Blah, blah, blah.
Leaching on the NHS.
Blah, blah, blah.
Private sector can fill its pockets.
Blah, blah, blah.
Blah, blah, blah.
ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ.
Thatcher this. Blah, blah, blah. Thatcher that. Blah, blah, blah. 1979. Blah, blah, blah. Right wing. Blah, blah, blah. aka. Blah, blah, blah. Capitalist. Blah, blah, blah. Economic and Political. Blah, blah, blah. Failed system. Blah, blah, blah. False picture. Blah, blah, blah. Communist capitalist. Blah, blah, blah. 100% Capitalism. Blah, blah, blah. Neo-Liberalism. Blah, blah, blah. Neo-Nationalism. Blah, blah, blah. Not propaganda. Blah, blah, blah. False propaganda. Blah, blah, blah. Private sector can fill its pockets. Blah, blah, blah. Hidden agenda. Blah, blah, blah. No more real jobs for people. Blah, blah, blah. False image that being put up. Blah, blah, blah. 100% control of the system. Blah, blah, blah. Now for 32 years. Blah, blah, blah. I am giving information that people often overlook. Blah, blah, blah. Leaching on the NHS. Blah, blah, blah. Private sector can fill its pockets. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah. ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ. freefinker

3:36pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'll do it.

In this particular thread, we're highlighting to you that you are repeatedly carrying out the exact action you accuse others of. You use the Echo site as a platform for some very thinly-veiled propaganda, whilst simultaneously accusing anyone who disagrees with you of spreading 'far right capitalist propaganda'. We are doing our bit to make sure that others are aware of your underhand tricks. I'd also like to think I'm getting through to YOU, but alas that may be wishful thinking.

On a larger scale, making sure your endless sneaky tricks and outright lies do not go un-highlighted.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'll do it. In this particular thread, we're highlighting to you that you are repeatedly carrying out the exact action you accuse others of. You use the Echo site as a platform for some very thinly-veiled propaganda, whilst simultaneously accusing anyone who disagrees with you of spreading 'far right capitalist propaganda'. We are doing our bit to make sure that others are aware of your underhand tricks. I'd also like to think I'm getting through to YOU, but alas that may be wishful thinking. On a larger scale, making sure your endless sneaky tricks and outright lies do not go un-highlighted. Georgem

3:43pm Thu 2 Aug 12

southy says...

Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite.

With evidence.

Good enough answer?
No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.
[quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite. With evidence. Good enough answer?[/p][/quote]No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know. southy

3:56pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Torchie1 says...

freefinker wrote:
Thatcher this.
Blah, blah, blah.
Thatcher that.
Blah, blah, blah.
1979.
Blah, blah, blah.
Right wing.
Blah, blah, blah.
aka.
Blah, blah, blah.
Capitalist.
Blah, blah, blah.
Economic and Political.
Blah, blah, blah.
Failed system.
Blah, blah, blah.
False picture.
Blah, blah, blah.
Communist capitalist.
Blah, blah, blah.
100% Capitalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Neo-Liberalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Neo-Nationalism.
Blah, blah, blah.
Not propaganda.
Blah, blah, blah.
False propaganda.
Blah, blah, blah.
Private sector can fill its pockets.
Blah, blah, blah.
Hidden agenda.
Blah, blah, blah.
No more real jobs for people.
Blah, blah, blah.
False image that being put up.
Blah, blah, blah.
100% control of the system.
Blah, blah, blah.
Now for 32 years.
Blah, blah, blah.
I am giving information that people often overlook.
Blah, blah, blah.
Leaching on the NHS.
Blah, blah, blah.
Private sector can fill its pockets.
Blah, blah, blah.
Blah, blah, blah.
ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ.
You left off "it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda" in the 2:10 rambling. Almost as funny as Stalin, the communist capitalist.
[quote][p][bold]freefinker[/bold] wrote: Thatcher this. Blah, blah, blah. Thatcher that. Blah, blah, blah. 1979. Blah, blah, blah. Right wing. Blah, blah, blah. aka. Blah, blah, blah. Capitalist. Blah, blah, blah. Economic and Political. Blah, blah, blah. Failed system. Blah, blah, blah. False picture. Blah, blah, blah. Communist capitalist. Blah, blah, blah. 100% Capitalism. Blah, blah, blah. Neo-Liberalism. Blah, blah, blah. Neo-Nationalism. Blah, blah, blah. Not propaganda. Blah, blah, blah. False propaganda. Blah, blah, blah. Private sector can fill its pockets. Blah, blah, blah. Hidden agenda. Blah, blah, blah. No more real jobs for people. Blah, blah, blah. False image that being put up. Blah, blah, blah. 100% control of the system. Blah, blah, blah. Now for 32 years. Blah, blah, blah. I am giving information that people often overlook. Blah, blah, blah. Leaching on the NHS. Blah, blah, blah. Private sector can fill its pockets. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah. ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ, ZZZZ.[/p][/quote]You left off "it can also be used to hide a hiden agenda" in the 2:10 rambling. Almost as funny as Stalin, the communist capitalist. Torchie1

3:57pm Thu 2 Aug 12

freefinker says...

southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite.

With evidence.

Good enough answer?
No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.
.. nobody is suppressing your views southy. We just counter your nonsense with fact, opinion and rationality.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite. With evidence. Good enough answer?[/p][/quote]No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.[/p][/quote].. nobody is suppressing your views southy. We just counter your nonsense with fact, opinion and rationality. freefinker

4:20pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite.

With evidence.

Good enough answer?
No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.
Disagreeing with someone isn't "suppressing" their opinion. When you use endless tricks to wriggle out of proving anything you say;

when you put vast amounts of effort into discrediting other people by including the words "I don't do unlike Georgem and Shoong", or "you're a bit thick aren't you" or "maybe when you know as much as me come back", or any other set of words designed specifically to make the person you're addressing look dishonest to people who aren't aware of your tactics;

when you lie extensively about laws then pretend later that you provided evidence for their existence;

when you repeatedly accuse anyone who disagrees with you of "far right propaganda";

when you simply invent sources for information you made up, when you weave endless webs of lies to make yourself appear the only knowledgeable person on this site, whilst simultaneously using every trolling tactic under the sun to make everyone else seem like they're blustering know-nothing idiots;

when you refuse to admit you're wrong about anything, ever, and will flat-out lie to cover your tracks;

when others provide evidence that is contrary to your own point, and you state that it has been falsified;

when you do all that, THAT is trying to suppress other points you do not want aired.

There are just some of the tactics you employ, repeatedly, to try and trick others commenting into believing you alone are correct, and everyone else is wrong. The mask is slipping. You've overplayed your hand. Your stupidity is going to haunt you here until you learn to discuss things rationally and evenly.
[quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite. With evidence. Good enough answer?[/p][/quote]No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.[/p][/quote]Disagreeing with someone isn't "suppressing" their opinion. When you use endless tricks to wriggle out of proving anything you say; when you put vast amounts of effort into discrediting other people by including the words "I don't do unlike Georgem and Shoong", or "you're a bit thick aren't you" or "maybe when you know as much as me come back", or any other set of words designed specifically to make the person you're addressing look dishonest to people who aren't aware of your tactics; when you lie extensively about laws then pretend later that you provided evidence for their existence; when you repeatedly accuse anyone who disagrees with you of "far right propaganda"; when you simply invent sources for information you made up, when you weave endless webs of lies to make yourself appear the only knowledgeable person on this site, whilst simultaneously using every trolling tactic under the sun to make everyone else seem like they're blustering know-nothing idiots; when you refuse to admit you're wrong about anything, ever, and will flat-out lie to cover your tracks; when others provide evidence that is contrary to your own point, and you state that it has been falsified; when you do all that, THAT is trying to suppress other points you do not want aired. There are just some of the tactics you employ, repeatedly, to try and trick others commenting into believing you alone are correct, and everyone else is wrong. The mask is slipping. You've overplayed your hand. Your stupidity is going to haunt you here until you learn to discuss things rationally and evenly. Georgem

4:56pm Thu 2 Aug 12

Georgem says...

...and he vanishes. Again.
...and he vanishes. Again. Georgem

12:32am Fri 3 Aug 12

Kyoboshi says...

Georgem wrote:
southy wrote:
Shoong wrote:
southy wrote:
Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.
I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite.

With evidence.

Good enough answer?
No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.
Disagreeing with someone isn't "suppressing" their opinion. When you use endless tricks to wriggle out of proving anything you say;

when you put vast amounts of effort into discrediting other people by including the words "I don't do unlike Georgem and Shoong", or "you're a bit thick aren't you" or "maybe when you know as much as me come back", or any other set of words designed specifically to make the person you're addressing look dishonest to people who aren't aware of your tactics;

when you lie extensively about laws then pretend later that you provided evidence for their existence;

when you repeatedly accuse anyone who disagrees with you of "far right propaganda";

when you simply invent sources for information you made up, when you weave endless webs of lies to make yourself appear the only knowledgeable person on this site, whilst simultaneously using every trolling tactic under the sun to make everyone else seem like they're blustering know-nothing idiots;

when you refuse to admit you're wrong about anything, ever, and will flat-out lie to cover your tracks;

when others provide evidence that is contrary to your own point, and you state that it has been falsified;

when you do all that, THAT is trying to suppress other points you do not want aired.

There are just some of the tactics you employ, repeatedly, to try and trick others commenting into believing you alone are correct, and everyone else is wrong. The mask is slipping. You've overplayed your hand. Your stupidity is going to haunt you here until you learn to discuss things rationally and evenly.
Well said....absolutely spot on.
[quote][p][bold]Georgem[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Shoong[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]southy[/bold] wrote: Who wants to tell Shoong and Georgem what they are doing, apart from being very childish.[/p][/quote]I'd like to think we're exposing you on a website no-one really cares about as a liar and a hypocrite. With evidence. Good enough answer?[/p][/quote]No your not you given out your own kind of propaganda and trying to suppress other points that you do not want people to know.[/p][/quote]Disagreeing with someone isn't "suppressing" their opinion. When you use endless tricks to wriggle out of proving anything you say; when you put vast amounts of effort into discrediting other people by including the words "I don't do unlike Georgem and Shoong", or "you're a bit thick aren't you" or "maybe when you know as much as me come back", or any other set of words designed specifically to make the person you're addressing look dishonest to people who aren't aware of your tactics; when you lie extensively about laws then pretend later that you provided evidence for their existence; when you repeatedly accuse anyone who disagrees with you of "far right propaganda"; when you simply invent sources for information you made up, when you weave endless webs of lies to make yourself appear the only knowledgeable person on this site, whilst simultaneously using every trolling tactic under the sun to make everyone else seem like they're blustering know-nothing idiots; when you refuse to admit you're wrong about anything, ever, and will flat-out lie to cover your tracks; when others provide evidence that is contrary to your own point, and you state that it has been falsified; when you do all that, THAT is trying to suppress other points you do not want aired. There are just some of the tactics you employ, repeatedly, to try and trick others commenting into believing you alone are correct, and everyone else is wrong. The mask is slipping. You've overplayed your hand. Your stupidity is going to haunt you here until you learn to discuss things rationally and evenly.[/p][/quote]Well said....absolutely spot on. Kyoboshi

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