Labour chooses candidate for Hampshire police commissioner (From Daily Echo)

Haha how can someone standing on behalf of the Labour Party particularly someone as blatantly partisan as the cabinet member for communities possibly "protect the police from political interference".

This is naked opportunism from the big three parties only one of which even supports this policy nationally that has created an £80k gravy train for one lucky snout in the trough.

The public dont want this. The police dont want this, the only people who benefit are our criminally corrupt politicans and the criminals on our streets as our policing is thrown into organisational confusion.

I urge people to treat this election with the contempt it deserves and stay at home.

I believe that this lady was the one who obstructed the council tax rebate for special constables.

Verloren Hoop wrote:
I believe that this lady was the one who obstructed the council tax rebate for special constables.

Rightly so ......... 100% discount for special constables ..... disgusting

SotonGreen wrote:
Haha how can someone standing on behalf of the Labour Party particularly someone as blatantly partisan as the cabinet member for communities possibly "protect the police from political interference".

This is naked opportunism from the big three parties only one of which even supports this policy nationally that has created an £80k gravy train for one lucky snout in the trough.

The public dont want this. The police dont want this, the only people who benefit are our criminally corrupt politicans and the criminals on our streets as our policing is thrown into organisational confusion.

I urge people to treat this election with the contempt it deserves and stay at home.

Good question, but why did you not make the same comment when The Echo announced on Saturday 16 June that Michael Mates, the former East Hampshire Tory MP and Donna Jones, a Tory Councillor for Cosham in Portsmouth were the Tory candidates for the job?

Are you so Tory-biased that you think that they would not be 'blatantly partisan'?

Are you really that Green?

Verloren Hoop wrote:
I believe that this lady was the one who obstructed the council tax rebate for special constables.

.. oh well, at least she got something right - but that's no reason to vote for this awfull politician.

Agree 100% with SotonGreen

In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

Sotongreen or not green whatever is the case. Don’t make this a personal crusade against one person. Cllr Jacqui Rayment has for the past few years been the chair of The Hampshire Police Authority, and she has been the only Labour representative on that body all the other being Tories or Lib Dems. They consistently voted for Jacqui to be the chair. During the local council elections a Southampton a Tory Councillor who sat on the authority, was going round saying it is Labour who are responsible for closing the police stations and all the other associated items, it was not until a tweet went out, that pointed out that he was at the committee that voted for the closure and associated activities, that he suddenly stopped doing this.
You should be turning your anger not on who ever are the candidates for these positions right across the country, the person you should be turning your anger on is the Home Secretary, The Rt. Hon Teresa May, who is responsible for all the mayhem that is happening and all the money that is being spent on these elections. They wanted to have American style Police Commissioners in the belief that this will cut crime as the Chief Constable would be answerable to one person. It is funny how some of the states in America are actually turning away from having elected Police Commissioners and are going over to having a Police Authority like we use to have. So Sotongreen or not green or greentory whatever you are turn your anger on Teresa May and call me Dave, and Nick “we are all in this together”, for wasting money that the country is meant to be short of at the moment. Alternatively stand yourself, as an independent; I am sure you would get the votes. But I know when I see my ballot paper, I will not see you on it, as like a lot of people who are full of hot air they do nothing about it.

SotonGreen wrote:
In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

They may be creating the new positions, but at the same time they are cutting the police funding budget, which has seen a reduction in police numbers.

I may also remind you that one of Cameron's election promises was that the Tories would be 'Tough on Crime.'

SotonGreen wrote:
In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

Quote from SotonGreen :- .. I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.
.
Did you also express your concerns when we had a Tory councillor Neil Fitzgerald living 5000 miles away in California and still being paid by the Taxpayer............ I would suggest that you did not ....... I wonder why

Linesman wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

They may be creating the new positions, but at the same time they are cutting the police funding budget, which has seen a reduction in police numbers.

I may also remind you that one of Cameron's election promises was that the Tories would be 'Tough on Crime.'

Yes, I seem to remember someone else from another party saying 'tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime'.

It was about oohh 1997, and we all know how that turned out.

So please don't try to make out one is better than the other.

I think the whole thing is a farce, why does any candidate have to be associated with a political party, i thought the whole concept was to give the public a bit of a say in how the police force operates, not just an extension off politics and another 80k down the pan.

Keep Politics out of the Police Force.

Looking at the situation in Egypt should make us grateful that, in this country, the armed forces and police are kept at arm’s length from the Politicians, up to now that is.

This American ` Commissioner Gordon` system should never of been adopted here. What next, Batman??

I firmly believe that political interference in policing is the main cause of the current problems we have, and was prepared to stand as an independent, for no pay, until I discovered that a £5000 deposit is required.to stand. As only political parties are likely to be able to afford this it's obvious the politicians do not want common sense getting in their way. However I did ask Jacqui Rayment for her views on this and discovered she also believes the post should be free of politics, so as she has the experience and is prepared to stay free of party politics I shall, for the first time in my life, be voting Labour.

To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

Al, you are being hoodwinked, she says she wants to be politically independent and then makes blatantly party political points and enacts a party political agenda. Look at her role as community cabinet member and deputy leader of the Labour group. She is a political scrapper down in the gutter along with the rest of us, to pretend otherwise is simply dishonest.

I am not a political person and hold no allegience to any party. If we have to have a Police Commissioner (I'm not in favour) at least Jacqui Rayment has years of experience with the Hampshire Police Authority and is fully aware of all the problems that exist within Hampshire Police.

Well done Jacqui on being selected. You have done a great job over the last few years as chair of the police authority and you would make an excellent commissioner.

SotonGreen wrote:
Al, you are being hoodwinked, she says she wants to be politically independent and then makes blatantly party political points and enacts a party political agenda. Look at her role as community cabinet member and deputy leader of the Labour group. She is a political scrapper down in the gutter along with the rest of us, to pretend otherwise is simply dishonest.

Actually have got to know her quite well, yes she is a scrapper but one that I want on my side. I have actually learned to trust her, despite honest politician, of any party, being an oxymoron.

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

sburman wrote:
Keep Politics out of the Police Force.

Looking at the situation in Egypt should make us grateful that, in this country, the armed forces and police are kept at arm’s length from the Politicians, up to now that is.

This American ` Commissioner Gordon` system should never of been adopted here. What next, Batman??

Where have you been hiding to, the Police have all ways been in with Politicians, they use to stand for Government Local and National in the Tory Party.

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

southy wrote:

sburman wrote:
Keep Politics out of the Police Force.

Looking at the situation in Egypt should make us grateful that, in this country, the armed forces and police are kept at arm’s length from the Politicians, up to now that is.

This American ` Commissioner Gordon` system should never of been adopted here. What next, Batman??

Where have you been hiding to, the Police have all ways been in with Politicians, they use to stand for Government Local and National in the Tory Party.

Actually, when the Met was first started in 1839 the great thing that Robert Peel managed was to keep it free of political interference. This worked fine until a few years ago when politicians started to stick their beaks in. Interestingly Commissioner Blair was obviously Labour, Padwick a Lib Dem and Paul Condon and the rest I have been unable to place politically.

Inform Al wrote:

southy wrote:

sburman wrote:
Keep Politics out of the Police Force.

Looking at the situation in Egypt should make us grateful that, in this country, the armed forces and police are kept at arm’s length from the Politicians, up to now that is.

This American ` Commissioner Gordon` system should never of been adopted here. What next, Batman??

Where have you been hiding to, the Police have all ways been in with Politicians, they use to stand for Government Local and National in the Tory Party.

Actually, when the Met was first started in 1839 the great thing that Robert Peel managed was to keep it free of political interference. This worked fine until a few years ago when politicians started to stick their beaks in. Interestingly Commissioner Blair was obviously Labour, Padwick a Lib Dem and Paul Condon and the rest I have been unable to place politically.

Well sort of but Peel him self was a Politician he was Prime Minister was he not, so in reality the Police was born out off Politics.
Robert Peel was leader of the Country Party also known as the Conservative party at the time who are also known as the Tory Party.
Though out the Police history they have been involved in Politics, high Ranking Officers have stood in Elections as members to the Torys partys, they also been made peers to the House of Lords sitting for the Tory Party.

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

No I didn't realise that there was this alliance - because I don't give a rat's behind - and nor does anyone else.

You read? You'd think that you might have a grasp of grammar and spelling then so I don't believe that. Wiki web site? WTF is that? Anyone with a noggin knows that Wikis are only as reliable as the author, I'm quite capable of making my own mind up. That's a big prob with you Pete, you assume everyone else is stupid because we don't fall for the rhetoric.

Take the Left Wing propaganda machine somewhere else, I for one am fed up with you popping up with your paranoia and Left Wing propaganda everyday.

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. and you? Debate?!
You truly are the gift that keeps on giving Pete.

SotonGreen wrote:
Haha how can someone standing on behalf of the Labour Party particularly someone as blatantly partisan as the cabinet member for communities possibly "protect the police from political interference".

This is naked opportunism from the big three parties only one of which even supports this policy nationally that has created an £80k gravy train for one lucky snout in the trough.

The public dont want this. The police dont want this, the only people who benefit are our criminally corrupt politicans and the criminals on our streets as our policing is thrown into organisational confusion.

I urge people to treat this election with the contempt it deserves and stay at home.

Factual and intelligent comment bar the last bit.

Rather than advising people to ignore the election Greens and socialists should be getting together and field their joint candidate.

No doubt about it that by introducing virtual copy of American system of policing our parliament has changed the nature of policing from neutrality to politically controlled.  Real socialists and those within Greens who are better than one trick ponies, should join up and campaign against this system.

This election in which voting is likely to be even lower than for local elections joint candidacy of Socialists and Greens will not only provide likes of me to vote for somebody (I most certainly won't be voting for this woman although she is Labour candidate) but it can also be used to get across the very good points in comment above.

Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

dave1958 wrote:
Sotongreen or not green whatever is the case. Don’t make this a personal crusade against one person. Cllr Jacqui Rayment has for the past few years been the chair of The Hampshire Police Authority, and she has been the only Labour representative on that body all the other being Tories or Lib Dems. They consistently voted for Jacqui to be the chair. During the local council elections a Southampton a Tory Councillor who sat on the authority, was going round saying it is Labour who are responsible for closing the police stations and all the other associated items, it was not until a tweet went out, that pointed out that he was at the committee that voted for the closure and associated activities, that he suddenly stopped doing this.
You should be turning your anger not on who ever are the candidates for these positions right across the country, the person you should be turning your anger on is the Home Secretary, The Rt. Hon Teresa May, who is responsible for all the mayhem that is happening and all the money that is being spent on these elections. They wanted to have American style Police Commissioners in the belief that this will cut crime as the Chief Constable would be answerable to one person. It is funny how some of the states in America are actually turning away from having elected Police Commissioners and are going over to having a Police Authority like we use to have. So Sotongreen or not green or greentory whatever you are turn your anger on Teresa May and call me Dave, and Nick “we are all in this together”, for wasting money that the country is meant to be short of at the moment. Alternatively stand yourself, as an independent; I am sure you would get the votes. But I know when I see my ballot paper, I will not see you on it, as like a lot of people who are full of hot air they do nothing about it.

Dave you are right people should be encouraged to participate in democratic process. If they do not want to vote for any of the candidates they can always spoil the ballot paper in the absence of 'None of these' choice on that paper. I did that when now self confessed 'Liar' Cllr Keith Morrell was NuLabour's candidate.

While agreeing with basic point of your comment, I can't share your view on Jacqui Rayment. As chair of Police Authority in my opinion her record was worse than even former Tory Chairman of the same, certain Capt Boyle; well known for boozing and once missing the meeting when he walked out of his train where there was no platform. 

Rather than criticising the Chief Constables on behalf of the people when required, she always acted if she was paid thousands from public purse to be cheer leader of the CC and rubber stamp in CC's back pocket.

Surely even NuLabour could have found a better candidate than her. Why could they not persuade Denham as he will not be standing for Parliament anymore?  I may not always agree with JD but have never doubted his ability. 

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. what utter nonsense.

The Green Party, previously the Ecology Party, has nothing to do with fringe Trotskyist groupings.

And, please be more specific? When you mention 'Socialist Greens' are you talking about Alliance for Green Socialism or Socialist Green Unity Coalition - both of which have no connection with the Green Party, are just Trotskyist fronts, and have had zero electoral success.

SotonGreen wrote:
Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

YES I admire your principled stand, which I expect from real environmentalists and true socialists. But rather than ignoring elections, we could have used this opportunity to draw public attention to principled policies.

Mahatma Gandhi also once made similar mistake when his Indian National Congress refused to contest elections to bodies they rightly thought could be toothless tigers, but then lived to regret because establishment of British Raj managed to get all their puppets elected, and with their help extended life of occupation and exploited Gandhi's nation.

That's the reason why although I have always opposed membership of obnoxious EU, I always participate in elections. Hope Greens will keep on campaigning against politicing policing and make use of every opportunity to argue for independent policing through consent, foundation of our famous system. 

Shoong wrote:

Linesman wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

They may be creating the new positions, but at the same time they are cutting the police funding budget, which has seen a reduction in police numbers.

I may also remind you that one of Cameron's election promises was that the Tories would be 'Tough on Crime.'

Yes, I seem to remember someone else from another party saying 'tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime'.

It was about oohh 1997, and we all know how that turned out.

So please don't try to make out one is better than the other.

But he did not follow it up by cutting the police budget did he?

Linesman wrote:

Shoong wrote:

Linesman wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
In answer to my perceived pro-Tory bias. I am against them standing too, they are however at least consistent in that they are the ones who are creating these new positions, so it makes sense for them to stand.

The Lib/Lab position is laughable. They say they are against directly elected commissioners and yet all over the country they are lining up candidates to sup from the trough.

Also as I have written elsewhere on this site, I have a specific concern about Jacqui as a cabinet member in Southampton and whether we as council tax payers are getting good value for money from her between now and November as she tours the county trying to get elected. I strongly suspect not.

They may be creating the new positions, but at the same time they are cutting the police funding budget, which has seen a reduction in police numbers.

I may also remind you that one of Cameron's election promises was that the Tories would be 'Tough on Crime.'

Yes, I seem to remember someone else from another party saying 'tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime'.

It was about oohh 1997, and we all know how that turned out.

So please don't try to make out one is better than the other.

But he did not follow it up by cutting the police budget did he?

No, he was probably flogging something to make up for it.

freefinker wrote:

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. what utter nonsense.

The Green Party, previously the Ecology Party, has nothing to do with fringe Trotskyist groupings.

And, please be more specific? When you mention 'Socialist Greens' are you talking about Alliance for Green Socialism or Socialist Green Unity Coalition - both of which have no connection with the Green Party, are just Trotskyist fronts, and have had zero electoral success.

Pete's just counting that we won't go and look it up.

Paramjit Bahia wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

YES I admire your principled stand, which I expect from real environmentalists and true socialists. But rather than ignoring elections, we could have used this opportunity to draw public attention to principled policies.

Mahatma Gandhi also once made similar mistake when his Indian National Congress refused to contest elections to bodies they rightly thought could be toothless tigers, but then lived to regret because establishment of British Raj managed to get all their puppets elected, and with their help extended life of occupation and exploited Gandhi's nation.

That's the reason why although I have always opposed membership of obnoxious EU, I always participate in elections. Hope Greens will keep on campaigning against politicing policing and make use of every opportunity to argue for independent policing through consent, foundation of our famous system. 

Will there ever come a day when Mahatma Gandhi is not something to do with something going on in the south of England in the year 2012 AD..?

freefinker wrote:

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. what utter nonsense.

The Green Party, previously the Ecology Party, has nothing to do with fringe Trotskyist groupings.

And, please be more specific? When you mention 'Socialist Greens' are you talking about Alliance for Green Socialism or Socialist Green Unity Coalition - both of which have no connection with the Green Party, are just Trotskyist fronts, and have had zero electoral success.

wow and your talking about putting your self foreward as a Green Candidate, heck no wonder you been blundering though.
The Green Party is an Allinance off Capitalist Greens and socialist Greens, so don't come that BS and try to duck out that your some thing totally different because your not.
There is only two Types of Economic and Political Policy Right Wing AKA the Capitalist and Left Wing AKA Socialist.
The Socialist Greens are part of the Green Party you have 2 or was it 3 Socialist Greens sitting on Brighton Council who refuse to back up the Cuts the Green Party made.
being Trotskyist is 10 times being any form of Capitalist it means that you care for people and put there needs before your own.

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

No I didn't realise that there was this alliance - because I don't give a rat's behind - and nor does anyone else.

You read? You'd think that you might have a grasp of grammar and spelling then so I don't believe that. Wiki web site? WTF is that? Anyone with a noggin knows that Wikis are only as reliable as the author, I'm quite capable of making my own mind up. That's a big prob with you Pete, you assume everyone else is stupid because we don't fall for the rhetoric.

Take the Left Wing propaganda machine somewhere else, I for one am fed up with you popping up with your paranoia and Left Wing propaganda everyday.

Yes I can see that you don't you want to put as many people down as you can so long as you get better.
Left wing aka Socialism is the Policy for the Majority mainly the working class, it dont jusy let one or two get better it helps the majority to get better. Unlike your Capitalist who got to deal with False Propaganda and Rhetoric because if people realise that Capitalism is just for the few it would lose any sort of power because the Majority would not vote for them.

Shoong if you don't like it then don't read or post simple as that.

Paramjit Bahia wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

YES I admire your principled stand, which I expect from real environmentalists and true socialists. But rather than ignoring elections, we could have used this opportunity to draw public attention to principled policies.

Mahatma Gandhi also once made similar mistake when his Indian National Congress refused to contest elections to bodies they rightly thought could be toothless tigers, but then lived to regret because establishment of British Raj managed to get all their puppets elected, and with their help extended life of occupation and exploited Gandhi's nation.

That's the reason why although I have always opposed membership of obnoxious EU, I always participate in elections. Hope Greens will keep on campaigning against politicing policing and make use of every opportunity to argue for independent policing through consent, foundation of our famous system. 

In last nights Echo it states that there has already been voting for the Tory candidates.......... ..
.
QUOTE:- Anyone who was on the electoral register in Hampshire regardless of political persuasion was eligible to vote for their preferred candidate and a total of 370 people signed up to do so.
.
YES 370 people in the whole Hampshire ........ What a waste of money.
.
Next time goverments complain about the turnout by union members re calling industrial action they should be reminded of this fiasco ......... a minute fraction of the Hampshire voting populating may well elect some 77 year old waste odf space

Paramjit Bahia wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

YES I admire your principled stand, which I expect from real environmentalists and true socialists. But rather than ignoring elections, we could have used this opportunity to draw public attention to principled policies.

Mahatma Gandhi also once made similar mistake when his Indian National Congress refused to contest elections to bodies they rightly thought could be toothless tigers, but then lived to regret because establishment of British Raj managed to get all their puppets elected, and with their help extended life of occupation and exploited Gandhi's nation.

That's the reason why although I have always opposed membership of obnoxious EU, I always participate in elections. Hope Greens will keep on campaigning against politicing policing and make use of every opportunity to argue for independent policing through consent, foundation of our famous system. 

And look at what the Greens done in Brighton, whos the candidates in Sussex.
You know what will happen here if these are Socialist Greens, the moment they look like they will win a seat they will be push to one side and a Captialist Green will be put in there place.

southy wrote:

freefinker wrote:

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. what utter nonsense.

The Green Party, previously the Ecology Party, has nothing to do with fringe Trotskyist groupings.

And, please be more specific? When you mention 'Socialist Greens' are you talking about Alliance for Green Socialism or Socialist Green Unity Coalition - both of which have no connection with the Green Party, are just Trotskyist fronts, and have had zero electoral success.

wow and your talking about putting your self foreward as a Green Candidate, heck no wonder you been blundering though.
The Green Party is an Allinance off Capitalist Greens and socialist Greens, so don't come that BS and try to duck out that your some thing totally different because your not.
There is only two Types of Economic and Political Policy Right Wing AKA the Capitalist and Left Wing AKA Socialist.
The Socialist Greens are part of the Green Party you have 2 or was it 3 Socialist Greens sitting on Brighton Council who refuse to back up the Cuts the Green Party made.
being Trotskyist is 10 times being any form of Capitalist it means that you care for people and put there needs before your own.

'Trotskyism has no real differences from Stalinism either in practice or theory' - Mattick.

The October Revolution was totalitarian - don't deny it.

Trotskyism was also promoted by mass propaganda, which is a pity because you accuse people of it everyday and claim to hate it. But as long as it's your kind of propaganda, I guess that's OK?

Trotskyism is another form of Totalitarianism which means suppression of the people it so likes to claim to love, personality cults and the best one of all, which should really turn you on - mass surveillance of the population.

Putting others needs before your own? Don't make me laugh, sipping champers while the dear people starve on the street below.

Trotskyism is as extreme as Nazi-ism. As everyone who does not agree with your Trotskyist views is called one, I would submit this makes you a complete hypocrite.

Do you know the difference between popularity and morality?

I'm sure your heroes from history look up at you on our mortal plane with great pride.

southy wrote:

freefinker wrote:

southy wrote:

Shoong wrote:

southy wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
To be clear although slightly off topic. I dont support the Tory party. I think they are an appalling party focussed on a privaledged few at the expense of the many. I think the behaviour of their representative continuing to receive his allowances was a terrible waste of scarce resources.

I vote for the Green Party, I am a member of the Green Party. I stood for the Green Party at the last election. I make no secret of this nor have I ever.

The Green Party are as bad as the Torys and Labour for making cuts and looking after the privaledged few, The Green Party is as Right Wing as the Labour, Lib/Dems, UKIP and the Torys.
The Socialist Greens are being kept back and only can fill in vacated spots with in the Green Alliance where a Capitalist Green don't fill the spot. Look what happened in Brighton and how much cuts they made.

Same old, same old, everyone is 'right wing' (or your idea of it). I think we could have predicted this one without you having even to post, cheers.
Take the propaganda & rhetoric somewhere else, we are all sick of it.

Whats up Shoong no case on your side again for you to be able to debate any thing.
True left wing there is no propaganda or rhetoric they don't need it, the Edvidence is out there for all to see, like I said look at Brighton and what happen there with cuts.
Mind you I don't expect you to relise that the Green Party is an Alliance between the Green and the Socialist Green, people like you never do because you don't do your research properly, you don't like reading in books to find out real facts now do you, you just keep to your wiki web side.

.. what utter nonsense.

The Green Party, previously the Ecology Party, has nothing to do with fringe Trotskyist groupings.

And, please be more specific? When you mention 'Socialist Greens' are you talking about Alliance for Green Socialism or Socialist Green Unity Coalition - both of which have no connection with the Green Party, are just Trotskyist fronts, and have had zero electoral success.

wow and your talking about putting your self foreward as a Green Candidate, heck no wonder you been blundering though.
The Green Party is an Allinance off Capitalist Greens and socialist Greens, so don't come that BS and try to duck out that your some thing totally different because your not.
There is only two Types of Economic and Political Policy Right Wing AKA the Capitalist and Left Wing AKA Socialist.
The Socialist Greens are part of the Green Party you have 2 or was it 3 Socialist Greens sitting on Brighton Council who refuse to back up the Cuts the Green Party made.
being Trotskyist is 10 times being any form of Capitalist it means that you care for people and put there needs before your own.

.. I have NEVER even contemplated putting myself forward as a Green Party candidate.

I am NOT a member of the Green Party - indeed, to misquote Groucho Marx; I wouldn’t join any political party that would have me as a member.

But I am a psephologist, so know what I’m talking about. You, however, just make it up as you go along. You know nothing about economics, the green movement or indeed politics, with the exception of the many factious strands of the pathetically insignificant Trotskyist movement.

Peoples Popular Front of Judea, Judean Popular Peoples Front – splitter.

Lone Ranger. wrote:

Paramjit Bahia wrote:

SotonGreen wrote:
Paramijt,

No that would be hypocritical as was my point at the beginning. If as we believe that there is no need for a commissioner and that the public are better represented on policing matters by a police authority consisting of local representatives then why on earth would we stand a candidate for a single person representing the whole of hampshire & IOW. If the Green movement is about anything then it is about local democracy and this runs counter to that core tenet.

YES I admire your principled stand, which I expect from real environmentalists and true socialists. But rather than ignoring elections, we could have used this opportunity to draw public attention to principled policies.

Mahatma Gandhi also once made similar mistake when his Indian National Congress refused to contest elections to bodies they rightly thought could be toothless tigers, but then lived to regret because establishment of British Raj managed to get all their puppets elected, and with their help extended life of occupation and exploited Gandhi's nation.

That's the reason why although I have always opposed membership of obnoxious EU, I always participate in elections. Hope Greens will keep on campaigning against politicing policing and make use of every opportunity to argue for independent policing through consent, foundation of our famous system. 

In last nights Echo it states that there has already been voting for the Tory candidates.......... ..
.
QUOTE:- Anyone who was on the electoral register in Hampshire regardless of political persuasion was eligible to vote for their preferred candidate and a total of 370 people signed up to do so.
.
YES 370 people in the whole Hampshire ........ What a waste of money.
.
Next time goverments complain about the turnout by union members re calling industrial action they should be reminded of this fiasco ......... a minute fraction of the Hampshire voting populating may well elect some 77 year old waste odf space

I do not agree with holding anybody's age against them, as all citizens should be entitled to participate in democracy.

My only concerns are:
This system is going to change the nature of our policing.
And the man is a hard line TORY.

southy wrote:
Shoong if you don't like it then don't read or post simple as that.

Sorry, but if you don't like your fascist views challenged then don't post, simple as that.

southy wrote:
Shoong if you don't like it then don't read or post simple as that.

Southy as a socialist you should be respecting others right to hold views different to yours and their right of expression even although some of them are pests

Paramjit Bahia wrote:

southy wrote:
Shoong if you don't like it then don't read or post simple as that.

Southy as a socialist you should be respecting others right to hold views different to yours and their right of expression even although some of them are pests

.. problem is, Paramjit, unlike you, southy is NOT a socialist - he's a Trotskyist.

Make no mistake about it, the Socialist Party (England and Wales), to which southy belongs, is affiliated to the Committee for a Workers' International (CWI) is an international association of Trotskyist parties.

As such, southy belong to a cult - every bit as bad as religious cults like the Scientologists, Moonies, the Peoples Temple Agricultural Project (Jonestown), et al. There is a steady and consistent stream of propaganda fed to members via regular meetings, The Socialist newspaper and Socialism Today magazine.

Questioning the ‘party line’ is verboten and total and utter social exclusion is heaped upon deserters, even by family members.

Been there, done it, got the t-shirt – but decades ago.

Wonder if Southy has got his 100 signatures to stand as a PCC ?

There again TUSC won't yet have a hundred members in Hampshire yet.

Yawn!!!! The police are rubbish, politicians are rubbish, and will probably get worse, goodnight!

Southy is a troll. I just pass right over his/her posts.