MPs distance themselves from calls to axe bus passes for pensioners (From Daily Echo)

Why not just introduce a flat 50p fare?

Still gives cheap travel but creates some savings.

Nick Boles says older people must shoulder their fair share of spending cuts. Fair enough, but that is only one side of the story.

According to the Telegraph in October 2011 the value of private pensions has already fallen by one third over the past three years, I suspect much more over he longer term given the turmoil in the stock markets, low investment returns and the slashing of annuity rates to almost token rates.

Don't forget that Margaret Thatcher allowed companies to take pension holidays way back, plus allowed them to use the built up pension funds for their own purposes, the effect of which has been to critically undermine the growth potential.

And then Gordon Brown introduced the tax on dividends which substantially reduced the growth potential.

And then Osborne has reduced the updating of pensions to CPI rather than RPI which will incrementally reduce pensions by up to 20% over the next few years.

And Osborne has also done away with Age Allowances.

Plus of course the age at which a pension can be drawn is increasing over the next few years. Oh, and the age at which you qualify for a bus pass or fuel allowance is also stretching onto the future. And the increase in the age at which women will qualify for a pension is also increasing to align with those of men.

The only thing left seems to be no prescription charges at 60 (but only a very small proportion of the population pay the charges anyway) and the ability to join B&Qs Diamond Club.

So when Nick Boles mentions "fair share" perhaps he should define what is "fair" first.

Perhaps we should all become MPs and distribute largesse at taxpayers expense to our families to avoid what is mounting pensioner poverty? Or all become bankers so that in hard times of our own creation, the taxpayer can again bail us out.

I get the impression there are two distinct societies in this country, the bankers, politicians, the press, the financiers etc. whose self perpetuating society runs on itself and supporting each other financially and socially and then there's the rest of us, increasingly poor, and with little or no opportunity to break out of the cycle but providing the fodder for the other class.

So fair, yes let's have fairness but not on Boles' terms.

They always blather about "tough decisions" when they are cutting public services or trimming benefits from other areas of society. But with old people they are all too frightened of the grey backlash, even though it may be the right thing to do.

There needs to be means testing for all, so the people who need it can get it and those who don't, won't.

Family Man wrote:
Nick Boles says older people must shoulder their fair share of spending cuts. Fair enough, but that is only one side of the story.

According to the Telegraph in October 2011 the value of private pensions has already fallen by one third over the past three years, I suspect much more over he longer term given the turmoil in the stock markets, low investment returns and the slashing of annuity rates to almost token rates.

Don't forget that Margaret Thatcher allowed companies to take pension holidays way back, plus allowed them to use the built up pension funds for their own purposes, the effect of which has been to critically undermine the growth potential.

And then Gordon Brown introduced the tax on dividends which substantially reduced the growth potential.

And then Osborne has reduced the updating of pensions to CPI rather than RPI which will incrementally reduce pensions by up to 20% over the next few years.

And Osborne has also done away with Age Allowances.

Plus of course the age at which a pension can be drawn is increasing over the next few years. Oh, and the age at which you qualify for a bus pass or fuel allowance is also stretching onto the future. And the increase in the age at which women will qualify for a pension is also increasing to align with those of men.

The only thing left seems to be no prescription charges at 60 (but only a very small proportion of the population pay the charges anyway) and the ability to join B&Qs Diamond Club.

So when Nick Boles mentions "fair share" perhaps he should define what is "fair" first.

Perhaps we should all become MPs and distribute largesse at taxpayers expense to our families to avoid what is mounting pensioner poverty? Or all become bankers so that in hard times of our own creation, the taxpayer can again bail us out.

I get the impression there are two distinct societies in this country, the bankers, politicians, the press, the financiers etc. whose self perpetuating society runs on itself and supporting each other financially and socially and then there's the rest of us, increasingly poor, and with little or no opportunity to break out of the cycle but providing the fodder for the other class.

So fair, yes let's have fairness but not on Boles' terms.

I agree. Well put.

I wonder whether Nick Boles advised Cameron and Osborne not to reduce the higher rate of income tax.

I bet he didn't.

Julian Lewis MP says "..........and sometimes we have to take a view that the nation simply cannot afford something."
What nation would that be Dr Lewis?
Dr Lewis and Nick Boles MP fail to make clear that free prescriptions and bus passes are devolved matters. So the UK coalition government at Westminster has only the power to withdraw these benefits for England.
In Scotland and Wales these matters are decided by the Scottish and Welsh governments and they are unlikely to follow!
So, as ever, we English will be suffering cuts to bail out the British!

Dont worry about this as they will not consider it before the next election.
.
After which they wont be in power anyway

And I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that if and when Mr Cameron adopts this proposal, no doubt in the next parliament which is auguring so badly for all of us, these same Tory MPs with apparent principles will back the proposals once the whip is applied, no matter how gently and their principles will dissappear out of the window.

I have never been certain whether the bipartite political party we have serves us well or badly. On the one hand is is perhaps better to have a strong party in charge no matter how much you might dislike their
policies, or you end up with weak and short term government like Italy. And on the other hand you risk ending up with representatives who simply follow the party line so the voter himself is quite unrepresented and powerless.

I promise that which ever political party decides to meddle with the bus pass, will never ever get my vote again. Many others of the grey vote will also do the same.

**** the history of who did what and when. These are dramatic times. There is a cash crisis. The priorities must be to removing the deficit, to building warships and construct nuclear power stations. Cut everything else that is not life threatening. Well worth all but the poor putting up with paying bus fares and full fuel bills if it really helps secure the country for the next 30 years. We can go back to generous concessions when its done.

good-gosh wrote:
**** the history of who did what and when. These are dramatic times. There is a cash crisis. The priorities must be to removing the deficit, to building warships and construct nuclear power stations. Cut everything else that is not life threatening. Well worth all but the poor putting up with paying bus fares and full fuel bills if it really helps secure the country for the next 30 years. We can go back to generous concessions when its done.

Are you for real we are talking about bus passes etc and you talk about securing the country for the next 30 years, when you are getting on a bit you think in terms of the next 3 years.

This is just another unknown backbench MP trying to make a name for himself. Right, I have got a name for him, but they won't print it.He's had his fifteen minutes of fame, now just go away you little weasel.

They should pay. It's disgusting rich older people force the state for pay for them when they can afford it themselves.

This is what's wrong with out society!

Well said Family Man.
Society (although Maggie claimed there was no such thing) is judged on how it treats its weakest and poorest.
We now have corrupt politicians, news moguls, the millionaire's club Tory Cabinet and especially the bankers,whose greed brought this country and most of the industrialised nations of the world to its knees, treating the rest of us with utter contempt whilst continuing to pocket obscene amounts of money.
The Tories and their LibDem cohorts are rotten to the core, always have been always will be.

IssacJacobs wrote:
They should pay. It's disgusting rich older people force the state for pay for them when they can afford it themselves.

This is what's wrong with out society!

No, what's wrong with our society is the massive layer of it that think they alone should benefit from it, without contributing to it, and that those who DO contribute, are not entitled to benefit from it.

They're not talking about "rich" old people, just old people over a certain income. You can be sure no actual rich person takes a bus anywhere.

YOU are what's wrong with our society. Having nothing but contempt for the very people who make our society possible.

Roy S wrote:
I promise that which ever political party decides to meddle with the bus pass, will never ever get my vote again. Many others of the grey vote will also do the same.

I am not sure the Bus Pass actually costs all that much, if those that have one didn't have one they just wouldn't ride on the bus, therefore more empty busses, more routes cut and everyone suffers.

IssacJacobs wrote:
They should pay. It's disgusting rich older people force the state for pay for them when they can afford it themselves.

This is what's wrong with out society!

They? Who are you? Are you not planning to be one yourself?

Bagamn wrote:
This is just another unknown backbench MP trying to make a name for himself. Right, I have got a name for him, but they won't print it.He's had his fifteen minutes of fame, now just go away you little weasel.

Who?

IssacJacobs wrote:
They should pay. It's disgusting rich older people force the state for pay for them when they can afford it themselves. This is what's wrong with out society!

I am not quite sure what you are talking about; you must be under the impression that there are quite a few older people with substantial income and savings. There are not. Most old people are pretty poor and a lot of them are living well below the breadline which is considered to be about £250.00 a week. What is disgusting is people who come on here without a clue what they are talking about. You would be better off venting your spleen on the banksters and people who really use the system; not oaps who have paid into the system.

Does anyone know:
Are the bus companies paid up-front by the council for each issued pass (like a season ticket) or do the bus companies charge the council only for each journey made using the pass?

I do wish we as a nation will stop picking on the elderly.

Why can the Government go after all these millionaires who avoid Tax and Major companies who manage to get a massive reduction in Tax.

Hitting a few pensioners isn't going to make much difference, hit the big earners who are avoiding paying what they owe.

Stop picking on our elderly!

good-gosh wrote:
Does anyone know:
Are the bus companies paid up-front by the council for each issued pass (like a season ticket) or do the bus companies charge the council only for each journey made using the pass?

I was told the local council pays out for each ticket issued to bus passes .. I believe its 70p per ticket ..
That's a whole lot of 70p's a day .
I always wondered what was wrong with the old scheme where OAP'S could ride for half fare ? It had to be more profitable ..

countrywench wrote:

good-gosh wrote: Does anyone know: Are the bus companies paid up-front by the council for each issued pass (like a season ticket) or do the bus companies charge the council only for each journey made using the pass?

I was told the local council pays out for each ticket issued to bus passes .. I believe its 70p per ticket .. That's a whole lot of 70p's a day . I always wondered what was wrong with the old scheme where OAP'S could ride for half fare ? It had to be more profitable ..

As I said before, the bus companies find cash inconvenient. Many Pensioners have a Bus Pass but never use it, many a time I have tried to use the Card Reader on the bus and it hasn't always worked, how can they possibly keep an accurate record of how many people are actually travelling?