Gandalf backs The Hobbit pub (From Daily Echo)
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Sir Ian McKellen backs campaign to save The Hobbit pub in Southampton
9:55am Thursday 15th March 2012 in Business By Arron Hendy
Sir Ian McKellen as Gandalf
FILM star Ian Mckellen has joined a now 40,000 strong campaign backing the Hobbit pub in Southampton.
The actor has spoken out in support of the popular watering hole after a massive multi-national American company began a legal fight to force the boozer to change its name and theme.
Today's Daily Echo tells how fellow actor Stephen Fry came out in support of the internet campaign backing the pub in Bevois Valley Road.
And now his fellow actor on the Hobbit film currently being made in new Zealand has used Twitter and his own website to join the swell of support, calling the legal claim “unnecessary pettiness”.
He wrote: “I haven't yet talked to Stephen Fry about his disapproval of this Hollywood bullying but I'm with him all the way.
“All the way to The Hobbit pub once filming is over in July.”
The pub has been warned by the Saul Zaentz Company in America that it will face legal action if it does not drop all references to the works of author JRR Tolkien.
But the legendary 72-year-old actor and the other campaigners are arguing that a portrait of Gandalf, a main character in both The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings books and films, has hung outside the pub in Portswood for more than 20 years.
Comments(35)
JohnLR
says...
10:35am Thu 15 Mar 12
What next, taking The Two Towers Brewery to court because of their name?
Sod off Hollywood!
Linesman
says...
11:00am Thu 15 Mar 12
Magic!
Goldenwight
says...
11:20am Thu 15 Mar 12
mike80
says...
12:01pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Goldenwight wrote:I think the PR is mutually beneficial... keeps the new film in the spotlight and gives a local punters another reason to visit this establishment in support.
Are the filming company REALLY intending to sue 'The Hobbit', or is this just a cynical manipulation of the press to get a lot of free publicity?
Of course I am not saying that this isn't an extremely stressful time for the pub, but with two megastars throwing support to the pub - lets just hope they kept that letter from the Tolkein estate (I believe it was mentioned yesterday? Correct me if I am wrong) stating they could use the name!
Would that not supercede SZC's copyright infringement claim?
voiceinthecrowd
says...
12:05pm Thu 15 Mar 12
mummsie wrote:I have tried to p0int out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block.
Thanks Sir Ian! It's not a million dollar company... it's a ENGLISH pub which is a dying trade in this country. Keep up the good fight! Hollywood.. You don't rule the world although some of the people working for you, seem to THINK you do!!!
I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal.
If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit.
Its a sad world but true.
Actors etc would soon be on the dole
voiceinthecrowd
says...
12:06pm Thu 15 Mar 12
I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal.
If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit.
Its a sad world but true.
Actors etc would soon be on the dole
Huffter
says...
12:17pm Thu 15 Mar 12
JeffJefftyJeff
says...
12:19pm Thu 15 Mar 12
voiceinthecrowd wrote:What memorabillia are they selling?
I have tried to point out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block.
I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal.
If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit.
Its a sad world but true.
Actors etc would soon be on the dole
JeffJefftyJeff
says...
12:21pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Huffter wrote:The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.
Tony S
says...
12:28pm Thu 15 Mar 12
sarfhamton
says...
12:28pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Also, shut down the talking Heads, that band must be ready to sue.
Vic Reeves is ready to sue the Shooting Star and a group of carpenters are about to take the Joiners to court.
wr0ng1
says...
12:33pm Thu 15 Mar 12
bigfella777
says...
12:33pm Thu 15 Mar 12
You cant own a species of human being so obviously what the pub needs to do is stop cashing in on the upcoming film with all the merchandise.
Icklelady
says...
12:49pm Thu 15 Mar 12
JeffJefftyJeff wrote:T-**** that say "the hobbit."
voiceinthecrowd wrote:What memorabillia are they selling?
I have tried to point out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block.
I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal.
If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit.
Its a sad world but true.
Actors etc would soon be on the dole
I can't remember if they say "The hobbit pub" or just "the hobbit."
St Retford
says...
1:14pm Thu 15 Mar 12
HippieSparkles
says...
1:34pm Thu 15 Mar 12
St Retford wrote:What difference does it make what sort of pub it is? Or, for that matter, the sexuality of those supporting it? The point is that people are sitting up and paying attention to the real thing that matters. All support is very much welcome, all the more so from people like Sir Ian McKellen and Stephen Fry, regardless of sexuality or how they conduct their private lives.
Hmmm, so we've had Ian McKellen AND Stephen Fry stepping in to support it. I've not been to The Hobbit in about 10 years but I didn't think it was *that* sort of bar.
likewatchingbrazil
says...
2:25pm Thu 15 Mar 12
HippieSparkles wrote:yeah it really matter's what a pub is called, boring story about nothing important, end of
St Retford wrote: Hmmm, so we've had Ian McKellen AND Stephen Fry stepping in to support it. I've not been to The Hobbit in about 10 years but I didn't think it was *that* sort of bar.What difference does it make what sort of pub it is? Or, for that matter, the sexuality of those supporting it? The point is that people are sitting up and paying attention to the real thing that matters. All support is very much welcome, all the more so from people like Sir Ian McKellen and Stephen Fry, regardless of sexuality or how they conduct their private lives.
truelysaints
says...
2:28pm Thu 15 Mar 12
St Retford
says...
3:12pm Thu 15 Mar 12
HippieSparkles wrote:Just a bit of a joke, HS. In the context of Afghanistan, Syria, the privatisation of the NHS and the police and the impending financial collapse this story doesn't matter THAT much.
St Retford wrote: Hmmm, so we've had Ian McKellen AND Stephen Fry stepping in to support it. I've not been to The Hobbit in about 10 years but I didn't think it was *that* sort of bar.What difference does it make what sort of pub it is? Or, for that matter, the sexuality of those supporting it? The point is that people are sitting up and paying attention to the real thing that matters. All support is very much welcome, all the more so from people like Sir Ian McKellen and Stephen Fry, regardless of sexuality or how they conduct their private lives.
Huffter
says...
3:37pm Thu 15 Mar 12
JeffJefftyJeff wrote:Copyright, Design & Patents Act 1988
Huffter wrote: The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
southy
says...
3:37pm Thu 15 Mar 12
voiceinthecrowd wrote:Again it can only have copy right if its original, and none of it is, every thing about the Tolkiens works came from the pass Myths, charactors names are real or from a myth, places are real place names in the west of England, maps are from real maps, Even from the film costumes ect are copys from drawings that was done by some one else long before even Tolkien took pen to paper
mummsie wrote:I have tried to p0int out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block.
Thanks Sir Ian! It's not a million dollar company... it's a ENGLISH pub which is a dying trade in this country. Keep up the good fight! Hollywood.. You don't rule the world although some of the people working for you, seem to THINK you do!!!
I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal.
If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit.
Its a sad world but true.
Actors etc would soon be on the dole
JeffJefftyJeff
says...
3:41pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Huffter wrote:Nope - the only criminal offences under that act are to do with selling copyrighted material not sure naming your pub and putting up film posters is selling the copyright material.
JeffJefftyJeff wrote:Copyright, Design & Patents Act 1988
Huffter wrote: The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
Huffter
says...
3:46pm Thu 15 Mar 12
southy wrote:If it's registered as the property of a person or organisation then they own the rights to it - that's how copyright works! Perhaps you could take action against "Southys Wood Fired Pizza Restaurant" in Australia?
voiceinthecrowd wrote:Again it can only have copy right if its original, and none of it is, every thing about the Tolkiens works came from the pass Myths, charactors names are real or from a myth, places are real place names in the west of England, maps are from real maps, Even from the film costumes ect are copys from drawings that was done by some one else long before even Tolkien took pen to papermummsie wrote: Thanks Sir Ian! It's not a million dollar company... it's a ENGLISH pub which is a dying trade in this country. Keep up the good fight! Hollywood.. You don't rule the world although some of the people working for you, seem to THINK you do!!!I have tried to p0int out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block. I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal. If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit. Its a sad world but true. Actors etc would soon be on the dole
The Wickham Man
says...
4:04pm Thu 15 Mar 12
HippieSparkles wrote:The reason Retford's post is so funny is because of the humourless prissy puritanical reaction it brings out in people like you. You'll find that both McKellen and Fry enjoy talking about their sexuality though why they think anyone else wants to conepmplate a fat self regarding bombast and a feeble old cruiser at play beats me. (oooh a double entendre there....)
St Retford wrote:What difference does it make what sort of pub it is? Or, for that matter, the sexuality of those supporting it? The point is that people are sitting up and paying attention to the real thing that matters. All support is very much welcome, all the more so from people like Sir Ian McKellen and Stephen Fry, regardless of sexuality or how they conduct their private lives.
Hmmm, so we've had Ian McKellen AND Stephen Fry stepping in to support it. I've not been to The Hobbit in about 10 years but I didn't think it was *that* sort of bar.
HippieSparkles
says...
4:06pm Thu 15 Mar 12
St Retford wrote:Sorry to get a little uppity about your comment, StR; I understand your point. I agree, those issues are far greater than the plight of a small pub. That being said, people are stepping up as they feel they can do some good, or at least try to. The point I was trying to make was a positive one. What started off as a small following has sky-rocketed to global news in just a few days, because people care. It's times like this that give me a small shred of hope that humanity is still capable of compassion
HippieSparkles wrote:Just a bit of a joke, HS. In the context of Afghanistan, Syria, the privatisation of the NHS and the police and the impending financial collapse this story doesn't matter THAT much.
St Retford wrote: Hmmm, so we've had Ian McKellen AND Stephen Fry stepping in to support it. I've not been to The Hobbit in about 10 years but I didn't think it was *that* sort of bar.What difference does it make what sort of pub it is? Or, for that matter, the sexuality of those supporting it? The point is that people are sitting up and paying attention to the real thing that matters. All support is very much welcome, all the more so from people like Sir Ian McKellen and Stephen Fry, regardless of sexuality or how they conduct their private lives.
Huffter
says...
4:16pm Thu 15 Mar 12
JeffJefftyJeff wrote:So it's OK to sell a cocktail called "The Gandalf" ?
Huffter wrote:Nope - the only criminal offences under that act are to do with selling copyrighted material not sure naming your pub and putting up film posters is selling the copyright material.JeffJefftyJeff wrote:Copyright, Design & Patents Act 1988Huffter wrote: The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
bobbyboy
says...
4:17pm Thu 15 Mar 12
acid drop
says...
4:40pm Thu 15 Mar 12
JohnLR wrote:The yanks always want to rule the world,leave our pubs alone
Back the Hobbit! It's JRR Tolkiens original work so what right has SZC to bully a small local pub?
What next, taking The Two Towers Brewery to court because of their name?
Sod off Hollywood!
IronLady2010
says...
4:48pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Looking at it from a different angle, could they possibly be advertising and creating new business for the copyright owner?
I guess it's a little like ITunes you get a small sample of a music track FREE and if you like it you go ahead and purchase it.
The Hobbit Pub with their theme could infact encourage visitors to go out and purchase a book or a film.
Maybe a compromise could be the yanks give them 'official' merchandise to sell, so both parties win!
southy
says...
5:12pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Huffter wrote:The copy right laws require it to be a original, and not commonly used as every thing that the film and and what is in the books have been around for a very long time a lot longer that Tolkien was born, there is no copy righs infringement.
southy wrote:If it's registered as the property of a person or organisation then they own the rights to it - that's how copyright works! Perhaps you could take action against "Southys Wood Fired Pizza Restaurant" in Australia?
voiceinthecrowd wrote:Again it can only have copy right if its original, and none of it is, every thing about the Tolkiens works came from the pass Myths, charactors names are real or from a myth, places are real place names in the west of England, maps are from real maps, Even from the film costumes ect are copys from drawings that was done by some one else long before even Tolkien took pen to papermummsie wrote: Thanks Sir Ian! It's not a million dollar company... it's a ENGLISH pub which is a dying trade in this country. Keep up the good fight! Hollywood.. You don't rule the world although some of the people working for you, seem to THINK you do!!!I have tried to p0int out before that selling memorabelia is the stumbling block. I am glad that the actor Sir Ian is supporting the campaign which I do to save the name and Theme but NOT the infringement of copyright which I am sorry is illegal. If every film that came out was not legally backed NO one would make enough money to produce more films. Films need backers, Backers need profit. Its a sad world but true. Actors etc would soon be on the dole
There a list of Historians lining up to back the Hobbit Pub.
southy
says...
5:17pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Huffter wrote:Yes it is because of 2 reasons.
JeffJefftyJeff wrote:So it's OK to sell a cocktail called "The Gandalf" ?
Huffter wrote:Nope - the only criminal offences under that act are to do with selling copyrighted material not sure naming your pub and putting up film posters is selling the copyright material.JeffJefftyJeff wrote:Copyright, Design & Patents Act 1988Huffter wrote: The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
1/ Gandalf is a surname and there is no copy rights on surnames.
2/ Gandalf is from Norse Myth meaning wan waving wizzard.
southy
says...
5:21pm Thu 15 Mar 12
IronLady2010 wrote:If thats the case then Tolkien and film industry have broken copy right laws, all they have done is copied some thing thats been around longer than they have.
The Hobbit Pub is a themed pub, whilst using some Copyright material are they actually damaging or taking income away from the original copyright owner?
Looking at it from a different angle, could they possibly be advertising and creating new business for the copyright owner?
I guess it's a little like ITunes you get a small sample of a music track FREE and if you like it you go ahead and purchase it.
The Hobbit Pub with their theme could infact encourage visitors to go out and purchase a book or a film.
Maybe a compromise could be the yanks give them 'official' merchandise to sell, so both parties win!
Do your reseach
dango
says...
5:26pm Thu 15 Mar 12
Huffter
says...
7:26pm Thu 15 Mar 12
southy wrote:I'll be sure to let my neighbours Mr Baggins, Mr Gamgee & Mr Orc know.
Huffter wrote:Yes it is because of 2 reasons. 1/ Gandalf is a surname and there is no copy rights on surnames. 2/ Gandalf is from Norse Myth meaning wan waving wizzard.JeffJefftyJeff wrote:So it's OK to sell a cocktail called "The Gandalf" ?Huffter wrote:Nope - the only criminal offences under that act are to do with selling copyrighted material not sure naming your pub and putting up film posters is selling the copyright material.JeffJefftyJeff wrote:Copyright, Design & Patents Act 1988Huffter wrote: The pub is not at risk - simply being asked to comply with the law. Infringement of copyright is both a civil and criminal offence.The pub is at risk as it would cost a lot of money to re-brand. It's almost gone under as it is recently iirc. Also which criminal law is this an offence under?
mummsie says...
10:11am Thu 15 Mar 12