PGMOL throw out Southampton FC's complaint against referee Mark Clattenburg

Mark Clattenburg

Mark Clattenburg

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SAINTS' complaint against Mark Clattenburg has been struck out by referees bosses.

Saints wrote to the referees' governing body the Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL) on New Year's Eve, objecting to referee Clattenburg's conduct towards Adam Lallana in the 2-1 defeat at Everton on December 29.

Saints objected to Clattenburg's conduct in an exchange with the England midfielder. But after a review the PGMOL has ruled there is no case to answer.

In a letter, Southampton claimed Clattenburg told Lallana: "You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this."

The PGMOL has since confirmed it will take no further action on the matter, and Clattenburg is free to continue officiating as planned.

A statement reads: "PGMOL is committed to constructive dialogue and communication with clubs, managers and players.

"On December 31 PGMOL received a letter from Southampton who raised concerns about the conduct of Mark Clattenburg following their game with Everton on December 29.

"In a written response to Southampton PGMOL acknowledge that their complaint has been considered in full.

"However, given the nature of the conversation with the player, having reviewed the footage and spoken to the team of officials as well as the Premier League Match Delegate it has been found that there is no case to answer.

"Mark has the full support of PGMOL Management and will be considered for selection for all and any matches going forward in the usual way."

Clattenburg is scheduled to referee the third round FA Cup tie between Arsenal and Tottenham at the Emirates Stadium on Saturday evening.

After the PGMOL threw out Southampton's claims, he will now continue to officiate that game.

Clattenburg is no stranger to controversy, after Chelsea accused him of racially abusing midfielder John Mikel Obi last season in a hot-tempered Barclays Premier League clash with Manchester United at Stamford Bridge.

It took an FA inquiry to rule there was no case to answer and six months later Clattenburg was back officiating Chelsea once again.

Comments (45)

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3:00pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Seedhouse the Unrepentant says...

They haven't denied he said it though have they. They need to be categoric and explain either a) he didn't say it or b) he said it and they regard it as acceptable.

Go on NC go for the bastards!
They haven't denied he said it though have they. They need to be categoric and explain either a) he didn't say it or b) he said it and they regard it as acceptable. Go on NC go for the bastards! Seedhouse the Unrepentant
  • Score: 4

3:08pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

Seedhouse the Unrepentant wrote:
They haven't denied he said it though have they. They need to be categoric and explain either a) he didn't say it or b) he said it and they regard it as acceptable.

Go on NC go for the bastards!
No surprise in the decision when the PGMOL are their own judge and jury but it will be interesting to see if/when Clutts next gets a game at SMS or, for that matter one of our away games.

Now that he's been marked (no pun intended), if the FA gave him a Saints' game in the coming months, it would be like giving NC a two-fingered salute.
[quote][p][bold]Seedhouse the Unrepentant[/bold] wrote: They haven't denied he said it though have they. They need to be categoric and explain either a) he didn't say it or b) he said it and they regard it as acceptable. Go on NC go for the bastards![/p][/quote]No surprise in the decision when the PGMOL are their own judge and jury but it will be interesting to see if/when Clutts next gets a game at SMS or, for that matter one of our away games. Now that he's been marked (no pun intended), if the FA gave him a Saints' game in the coming months, it would be like giving NC a two-fingered salute. Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 0

3:08pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Well that isn't a surprise, they will always look after their own, perhaps time to create a petition to request that this person is not allowed to Referee another game where we are involved? Our real complaint is not the abuse of our players, but the ineptitude he has shown by not Refereeing our games in a fair manner. There have been just too many "mistakes" that have cost us.
Well that isn't a surprise, they will always look after their own, perhaps time to create a petition to request that this person is not allowed to Referee another game where we are involved? Our real complaint is not the abuse of our players, but the ineptitude he has shown by not Refereeing our games in a fair manner. There have been just too many "mistakes" that have cost us. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 4

3:12pm Fri 3 Jan 14

W Wallace says...

"You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this.

Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref?
Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game.
I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong.
But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)
"You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this. Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref? Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game. I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong. But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here) W Wallace
  • Score: 24

3:17pm Fri 3 Jan 14

dibsy1984 says...

So if Lallana had told Clattenberg he had changed since being rightly called a racist, what would they have done with Lallana!
I'm sorry but as i've already mentioned, this isnt the first time there has been a complaint made and like they say: theres no smoke without fire!
So if Lallana had told Clattenberg he had changed since being rightly called a racist, what would they have done with Lallana! I'm sorry but as i've already mentioned, this isnt the first time there has been a complaint made and like they say: theres no smoke without fire! dibsy1984
  • Score: -4

3:22pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Abbey Saint says...

W Wallace wrote:
"You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this. Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref? Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game. I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong. But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)
He's the captain and therefore allowed to approach the referee. Either his conduct and what he said is ok or it isn't . Either way the ref's response as reported is nonsense. He could have booked Adam for his behaviour if that was appropriate, but in any case the ref is there to adjudicate, not pass what are at best irrelevant personal observations. Once again I would say that this referee feels far to self important and well up himself.
[quote][p][bold]W Wallace[/bold] wrote: "You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this. Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref? Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game. I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong. But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)[/p][/quote]He's the captain and therefore allowed to approach the referee. Either his conduct and what he said is ok or it isn't . Either way the ref's response as reported is nonsense. He could have booked Adam for his behaviour if that was appropriate, but in any case the ref is there to adjudicate, not pass what are at best irrelevant personal observations. Once again I would say that this referee feels far to self important and well up himself. Abbey Saint
  • Score: -5

3:23pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Sadoldgitte says...

I was expecting something far stronger than that. If that what was all that was said why the fuss?
I was expecting something far stronger than that. If that what was all that was said why the fuss? Sadoldgitte
  • Score: 14

3:25pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Sadoldgitte says...

Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now. Sadoldgitte
  • Score: 16

3:33pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Cpt. Kirk's illegitimate love child says...

I suspect there was more to it than that. PGMO are very good with the brush and a can of white. Note the club still haven't released any statement so the quote from the letter is what PGMO have chosen to release and I have no doubt that they will do a PR job to protect their official; its what they do. Why can't they see that behaving the way they do (the ref is always right no matter what, even when he is plainly wrong) is counter productive in the long run and only leads to disrespect not respect for the officials. Everyone is human and makes mistakes, players and officials alike but the way they go about their business just pee's everyone off.
I suspect there was more to it than that. PGMO are very good with the brush and a can of white. Note the club still haven't released any statement so the quote from the letter is what PGMO have chosen to release and I have no doubt that they will do a PR job to protect their official; its what they do. Why can't they see that behaving the way they do (the ref is always right no matter what, even when he is plainly wrong) is counter productive in the long run and only leads to disrespect not respect for the officials. Everyone is human and makes mistakes, players and officials alike but the way they go about their business just pee's everyone off. Cpt. Kirk's illegitimate love child
  • Score: -3

3:33pm Fri 3 Jan 14

mbetts says...

Clattenburgs spot on!

Both Lallana and Rodriguez have changed since being called up for England, they're now playing amazingly full of confidence scoring spectacular goals!

Surely thats what he meant?
Clattenburgs spot on! Both Lallana and Rodriguez have changed since being called up for England, they're now playing amazingly full of confidence scoring spectacular goals! Surely thats what he meant? mbetts
  • Score: 3

3:35pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

W Wallace wrote:
"You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this.

Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref?
Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game.
I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong.
But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)
Let me make a comparison. I was once at a train station in Germany. For 20 minutes I was second in a queue trying to buy a ticket which cost a couple of euros to get me one stop along the line to the local airport. The person ahead of me in the queue was taking a long time. When she finished, a woman rushed ahead of me, leaving me still waiting in the queue. I was left no choice but to rush for the train which was now in the station. A ticket inspector came through the train, I asked for a ticket and explained what had happened. He refused to believe me, got off the train with me at the airport and fined me. I was furious but took it on the chin. THEN, he said, 'It's always the English who do this.' Thus, he suggested that I HAD deliberately tried to avoid paying €2 but most of all inferring that only English people dodge fares. In short, his comment was selective and judgmental (and racist).

Unless Clutt says the same to all players who challenge him shortly after their first international cap, his comment was equally selective and judgmental. Furthermore, it simply isn't true. I understand that Adam had offered the captain's armband to Kelv for the day, but he would still be the on-field player with the right to discuss things with the ref. After the 94th-minute penalty at Norwich last year, Adam was certainly one of those who spoke to Clutt.

People say and do things in the heat of the moment, we can all accept that. However, that doesn't mean they shouldn't be accountable for their words or actions.
[quote][p][bold]W Wallace[/bold] wrote: "You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this. Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref? Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game. I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong. But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)[/p][/quote]Let me make a comparison. I was once at a train station in Germany. For 20 minutes I was second in a queue trying to buy a ticket which cost a couple of euros to get me one stop along the line to the local airport. The person ahead of me in the queue was taking a long time. When she finished, a woman rushed ahead of me, leaving me still waiting in the queue. I was left no choice but to rush for the train which was now in the station. A ticket inspector came through the train, I asked for a ticket and explained what had happened. He refused to believe me, got off the train with me at the airport and fined me. I was furious but took it on the chin. THEN, he said, 'It's always the English who do this.' Thus, he suggested that I HAD deliberately tried to avoid paying €2 but most of all inferring that only English people dodge fares. In short, his comment was selective and judgmental (and racist). Unless Clutt says the same to all players who challenge him shortly after their first international cap, his comment was equally selective and judgmental. Furthermore, it simply isn't true. I understand that Adam had offered the captain's armband to Kelv for the day, but he would still be the on-field player with the right to discuss things with the ref. After the 94th-minute penalty at Norwich last year, Adam was certainly one of those who spoke to Clutt. People say and do things in the heat of the moment, we can all accept that. However, that doesn't mean they shouldn't be accountable for their words or actions. Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: -2

3:42pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Alicesdad says...

Sadoldgitte wrote:
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence.

However I still predict a riot.
[quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.[/p][/quote]I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence. However I still predict a riot. Alicesdad
  • Score: 9

3:46pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Saint Madcap says...

It would appear that Football League Referee's think they are above the laws of the game and love to be the centre of attention.
In my opinion they should, at regular intervals, be sent to Referee at grassroots level to keep their feet on the ground.
Who remembers Fred Sturgess the Referee's Appointment's Secretary of the Southampton Sunday League? He was fair he was firm but he was never rude to players. He earned the respect of the players by the way he controlled the game. I am sure there are many examples of local Referee's that fit into the Sturgess mould and the "Superstar" Referee's of The Premier League should be made aware that they are not bigger than the game.
It would appear that Football League Referee's think they are above the laws of the game and love to be the centre of attention. In my opinion they should, at regular intervals, be sent to Referee at grassroots level to keep their feet on the ground. Who remembers Fred Sturgess the Referee's Appointment's Secretary of the Southampton Sunday League? He was fair he was firm but he was never rude to players. He earned the respect of the players by the way he controlled the game. I am sure there are many examples of local Referee's that fit into the Sturgess mould and the "Superstar" Referee's of The Premier League should be made aware that they are not bigger than the game. Saint Madcap
  • Score: -3

3:50pm Fri 3 Jan 14

right back in the bar says...

Strasbourg Saint wrote:
W Wallace wrote:
"You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this.

Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref?
Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game.
I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong.
But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)
Let me make a comparison. I was once at a train station in Germany. For 20 minutes I was second in a queue trying to buy a ticket which cost a couple of euros to get me one stop along the line to the local airport. The person ahead of me in the queue was taking a long time. When she finished, a woman rushed ahead of me, leaving me still waiting in the queue. I was left no choice but to rush for the train which was now in the station. A ticket inspector came through the train, I asked for a ticket and explained what had happened. He refused to believe me, got off the train with me at the airport and fined me. I was furious but took it on the chin. THEN, he said, 'It's always the English who do this.' Thus, he suggested that I HAD deliberately tried to avoid paying €2 but most of all inferring that only English people dodge fares. In short, his comment was selective and judgmental (and racist).

Unless Clutt says the same to all players who challenge him shortly after their first international cap, his comment was equally selective and judgmental. Furthermore, it simply isn't true. I understand that Adam had offered the captain's armband to Kelv for the day, but he would still be the on-field player with the right to discuss things with the ref. After the 94th-minute penalty at Norwich last year, Adam was certainly one of those who spoke to Clutt.

People say and do things in the heat of the moment, we can all accept that. However, that doesn't mean they shouldn't be accountable for their words or actions.
I find it hard to believe that right minded people in the game fail to see Cretinberg as a liability and embarrassment. There is a consistency in the type of controversy he attracts, which is that he is exercising judgement in situations rather than simply applying the rules of the game (the equivalent of a god complex in football; sounds absurd and it is, but the facts are that he is compelled to go on drawing attention to himself in his performances. The other big name ref is the same (forgotten his name): Suarez was fouled at Chelsea but the referee deemed it appropriate to suspend the rules of the game; its ridiculous and something needs to be done before someone gets killed. .
[quote][p][bold]Strasbourg Saint[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]W Wallace[/bold] wrote: "You are very different now, since you've played for England - you never used to be like this. Am I missing something? How can his conduct be questioned? What did the player say to the ref? Don't get me wrong I have fallen out with lots of ref's but this is surely an observation of someone within the game. I know the refs have one anothers backs, I think ref's should be accountable for decisions made and should stand up and apologise for those that are wrong. But this does seem a little petty in my opinion. ( I expect a lot of dislikes, that isn't my aim here)[/p][/quote]Let me make a comparison. I was once at a train station in Germany. For 20 minutes I was second in a queue trying to buy a ticket which cost a couple of euros to get me one stop along the line to the local airport. The person ahead of me in the queue was taking a long time. When she finished, a woman rushed ahead of me, leaving me still waiting in the queue. I was left no choice but to rush for the train which was now in the station. A ticket inspector came through the train, I asked for a ticket and explained what had happened. He refused to believe me, got off the train with me at the airport and fined me. I was furious but took it on the chin. THEN, he said, 'It's always the English who do this.' Thus, he suggested that I HAD deliberately tried to avoid paying €2 but most of all inferring that only English people dodge fares. In short, his comment was selective and judgmental (and racist). Unless Clutt says the same to all players who challenge him shortly after their first international cap, his comment was equally selective and judgmental. Furthermore, it simply isn't true. I understand that Adam had offered the captain's armband to Kelv for the day, but he would still be the on-field player with the right to discuss things with the ref. After the 94th-minute penalty at Norwich last year, Adam was certainly one of those who spoke to Clutt. People say and do things in the heat of the moment, we can all accept that. However, that doesn't mean they shouldn't be accountable for their words or actions.[/p][/quote]I find it hard to believe that right minded people in the game fail to see Cretinberg as a liability and embarrassment. There is a consistency in the type of controversy he attracts, which is that he is exercising judgement in situations rather than simply applying the rules of the game (the equivalent of a god complex in football; sounds absurd and it is, but the facts are that he is compelled to go on drawing attention to himself in his performances. The other big name ref is the same (forgotten his name): Suarez was fouled at Chelsea but the referee deemed it appropriate to suspend the rules of the game; its ridiculous and something needs to be done before someone gets killed. . right back in the bar
  • Score: -3

3:54pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Alicesdad says...

Clattenburg is an idiot, he likes the fame and tries to banter with the players so probably revelled in this. Leave it - he's not worth th effort. Just remember he's just a bloke who runs around in shorts blowing a whistle..just 100 years ago he would have been locked up until after the full moon.

However we should focus on major issues of the day and it is clear that Saints are becoming more and more guilty of abhorrent crimes against minority groups.

How long before Saints are accused of blatant racism? The number of English players we are using is clearly biased and shows how we are institutionally anti Johnny-foreigner. There will of course be those who reply that we have more nationalities in our squad than the average school Atlas... ha! what do they know !! Only recently the crowd was heard singing "Come On England" during a League Match. It even made the England Manager smile ... for heavens sake how much more proof do they need ?

These thing smust be taken seriously or we will lose all sense of perspective.

Have we had a riot yet ?
Clattenburg is an idiot, he likes the fame and tries to banter with the players so probably revelled in this. Leave it - he's not worth th effort. Just remember he's just a bloke who runs around in shorts blowing a whistle..just 100 years ago he would have been locked up until after the full moon. However we should focus on major issues of the day and it is clear that Saints are becoming more and more guilty of abhorrent crimes against minority groups. How long before Saints are accused of blatant racism? The number of English players we are using is clearly biased and shows how we are institutionally anti Johnny-foreigner. There will of course be those who reply that we have more nationalities in our squad than the average school Atlas... ha! what do they know !! Only recently the crowd was heard singing "Come On England" during a League Match. It even made the England Manager smile ... for heavens sake how much more proof do they need ? These thing smust be taken seriously or we will lose all sense of perspective. Have we had a riot yet ? Alicesdad
  • Score: -1

3:54pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Sadoldgitte says...

Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh!
Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh! Sadoldgitte
  • Score: 14

4:13pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Marchwood Malcom says...

Alicesdad wrote:
Sadoldgitte wrote:
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence.

However I still predict a riot.
I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.
[quote][p][bold]Alicesdad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.[/p][/quote]I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence. However I still predict a riot.[/p][/quote]I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet. Marchwood Malcom
  • Score: 9

4:14pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Chriops says...

I understand that Saints do not accept the dismissal of the complaint, and look to take this further.

It's a strange one really, and without the context of the discussion the complaint seems weak, but the question I would ask is what right does Clatterbug have to make personal comments regarding any player.

Lallana coming n for a lot of stick on social media, but the complaint has come from the club officials and not the player.
I understand that Saints do not accept the dismissal of the complaint, and look to take this further. It's a strange one really, and without the context of the discussion the complaint seems weak, but the question I would ask is what right does Clatterbug have to make personal comments regarding any player. Lallana coming n for a lot of stick on social media, but the complaint has come from the club officials and not the player. Chriops
  • Score: -1

4:19pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Costa Baz says...

Insulting? Yes. Worth making a fuss about? Probably not, unless the Premier League decide NOT to let him referee another of our games. In which case bang on!
Insulting? Yes. Worth making a fuss about? Probably not, unless the Premier League decide NOT to let him referee another of our games. In which case bang on! Costa Baz
  • Score: 6

4:21pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Marchwood Malcom says...

Sadoldgitte wrote:
Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh!
You are absolutely right. We should be concentrating on what's happening on the pitch and the general direction of the club. This matter hasn't done us any favours, if anything it makes us look like a bunch of small time muppets. From the first reports I thought that fool must have said something pretty bad, when in truth it was something daft.
[quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh![/p][/quote]You are absolutely right. We should be concentrating on what's happening on the pitch and the general direction of the club. This matter hasn't done us any favours, if anything it makes us look like a bunch of small time muppets. From the first reports I thought that fool must have said something pretty bad, when in truth it was something daft. Marchwood Malcom
  • Score: 4

4:23pm Fri 3 Jan 14

george chivers says...

Sadoldgitte wrote:
Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh!
I would make a fuss about if I was a player. The referee is there to referee the game on what he sees and hears and make decisions based on how he interprets that information.

He's not a journalist who is employed to comment on individual players or their attitudes. Or a school teacher giving an assessment of a pupil. I would regard his remarks as being patronizing and condescending if I was AL Especially as he has never played at a professional level. Let alone England. The sooner we get ex-professional players to become refs and put them on fast track development the better. Then we won't have to put up with people like MC. Time our sport was on the same basis as most major team games in the world, in terms of sourcing officials.

Yes I know many ex-professionals wouldn't be attracted to the job because of the money. But some from the lower divisions would, including The Conference would.

I'm with Seedhouse on this one. Go for him NC.
[quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh![/p][/quote]I would make a fuss about if I was a player. The referee is there to referee the game on what he sees and hears and make decisions based on how he interprets that information. He's not a journalist who is employed to comment on individual players or their attitudes. Or a school teacher giving an assessment of a pupil. I would regard his remarks as being patronizing and condescending if I was AL Especially as he has never played at a professional level. Let alone England. The sooner we get ex-professional players to become refs and put them on fast track development the better. Then we won't have to put up with people like MC. Time our sport was on the same basis as most major team games in the world, in terms of sourcing officials. Yes I know many ex-professionals wouldn't be attracted to the job because of the money. But some from the lower divisions would, including The Conference would. I'm with Seedhouse on this one. Go for him NC. george chivers
  • Score: -4

4:23pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Seedhouse the Unrepentant says...

Sadoldgitte wrote:
Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh!
His decision making is appalling and has cost us a lot of points. This complaint should at least keep him away from a saints game for a while. That alone makes it brilliant.
[quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Above the laws of the game? I am sorry but where does it say that referees arent allwed to speak to players? If that is all he said it is hardly earth shattering is it? I really cant believe that anyone would make such a fuss about something so trivial when there are far greater issues to deal with. Is the "Southampton Way" to be a bunch of wussy crybabies? Time to grow up and sort out what is going wrong on the pitch. I used to cringe with embarrassment when Fergie used to whinge on about this and that. Let's not go down that route eh![/p][/quote]His decision making is appalling and has cost us a lot of points. This complaint should at least keep him away from a saints game for a while. That alone makes it brilliant. Seedhouse the Unrepentant
  • Score: 0

4:33pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Norwegian Saint says...

The guy is a joke. If he is an official in a match of ours my head drops. The guy is probably part of a betting syndicate... did you see his response when Artur saved the penalty at Norwich? He looked sick. It will come out one day that he is cheating.
The decisions at Norwich, Arsenal and now Everton are not a coincidence.
Rascist, rude, cheating b'stard.... he would fit in well at Poopey.
The FA make them the untouchables.... Ok, not all can get 100% correct but the decisions he gives against us are soo blatant he has to be dodgy!
The guy is a joke. If he is an official in a match of ours my head drops. The guy is probably part of a betting syndicate... did you see his response when Artur saved the penalty at Norwich? He looked sick. It will come out one day that he is cheating. The decisions at Norwich, Arsenal and now Everton are not a coincidence. Rascist, rude, cheating b'stard.... he would fit in well at Poopey. The FA make them the untouchables.... Ok, not all can get 100% correct but the decisions he gives against us are soo blatant he has to be dodgy! Norwegian Saint
  • Score: 0

4:33pm Fri 3 Jan 14

JohnItaly says...

Unfortunately in a situation like this there is only going to be one winner and that will not be Saints. In fact it will seen as Southampton FC being "petty". As much as I condemn the fact that referees are unaccountable to any one other than their own governing body it has to said that referees do have to put up with a lot of abuse from players. Until clubs stamp out this unacceptable behaviour one cannot see the PGMOL doing anything but support their own and who would blame them.
Unfortunately in a situation like this there is only going to be one winner and that will not be Saints. In fact it will seen as Southampton FC being "petty". As much as I condemn the fact that referees are unaccountable to any one other than their own governing body it has to said that referees do have to put up with a lot of abuse from players. Until clubs stamp out this unacceptable behaviour one cannot see the PGMOL doing anything but support their own and who would blame them. JohnItaly
  • Score: 3

4:43pm Fri 3 Jan 14

st1halo says...

Must be all Saints day today. e're not accepting decision and now Dani gets fined 40k and banned for 3 games for the Newcastle affair. What next?

STID
Must be all Saints day today. e're not accepting decision and now Dani gets fined 40k and banned for 3 games for the Newcastle affair. What next? STID st1halo
  • Score: 0

4:55pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Marchwood Malcom says...

The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads.
The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads. Marchwood Malcom
  • Score: 2

5:15pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

Marchwood Malcom wrote:
Alicesdad wrote:
Sadoldgitte wrote:
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence.

However I still predict a riot.
I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.
Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-)

Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts.

1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here.

2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him.
[quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Alicesdad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.[/p][/quote]I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence. However I still predict a riot.[/p][/quote]I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.[/p][/quote]Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-) Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts. 1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here. 2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him. Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 1

5:23pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Norwegian Saint says...

Well... Well... Well..... check this comment out on an Everton site...

The Premier League have announced that Mark Clattenburg will referee an Everton home game for the first time in 6 years when he takes charge of the match against Southampton on 29th December.
The Tyne-and-Wear official caused outrage at Goodison Park for a trio of controversial decisions in the Merseyside derby of October 2007, a game that Liverpool won 2-1 and which would go down in Everton folklore as "The Clattenburg derby".

In the most notorious of the incidents, Clattenburg appeared to change his mind from awarding Tony Hibbert a yellow card for a "foul" on Steven Gerrard to a straight red card after the Reds' captain had a sly word in the referee's ear.

Dirk Kuyt equalised with the resulting penalty, even though Hibbert's challenge was outside the area, and he would go on to score the winner from the penalty spot in the 89th minute after Phil Neville's deliberately handled on the line.

It was argued that the Dutchman should not have been on the pitch by that point, however, following an outrageous, waist-high two-footed lunge on Neville earlier in the second half that didn't even merit a yellow card in the referee's eyes.

The final insult for Evertonians was Clattenburg's refusal to award a penalty at the other end in injury time when Jamie Carragher visibly hauled Joleon Lescott to the ground as the pair challenged for a corner.

Then manager David Moyes's fury ensured that Clattenburg would not officiate an Everton match until 2012 and has not returned to Goodison until now.

So why can't we stop him officiating any of our games???
Well... Well... Well..... check this comment out on an Everton site... The Premier League have announced that Mark Clattenburg will referee an Everton home game for the first time in 6 years when he takes charge of the match against Southampton on 29th December. The Tyne-and-Wear official caused outrage at Goodison Park for a trio of controversial decisions in the Merseyside derby of October 2007, a game that Liverpool won 2-1 and which would go down in Everton folklore as "The Clattenburg derby". In the most notorious of the incidents, Clattenburg appeared to change his mind from awarding Tony Hibbert a yellow card for a "foul" on Steven Gerrard to a straight red card after the Reds' captain had a sly word in the referee's ear. Dirk Kuyt equalised with the resulting penalty, even though Hibbert's challenge was outside the area, and he would go on to score the winner from the penalty spot in the 89th minute after Phil Neville's deliberately handled on the line. It was argued that the Dutchman should not have been on the pitch by that point, however, following an outrageous, waist-high two-footed lunge on Neville earlier in the second half that didn't even merit a yellow card in the referee's eyes. The final insult for Evertonians was Clattenburg's refusal to award a penalty at the other end in injury time when Jamie Carragher visibly hauled Joleon Lescott to the ground as the pair challenged for a corner. Then manager David Moyes's fury ensured that Clattenburg would not officiate an Everton match until 2012 and has not returned to Goodison until now. So why can't we stop him officiating any of our games??? Norwegian Saint
  • Score: 3

5:39pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

Norwegian Saint wrote:
Well... Well... Well..... check this comment out on an Everton site...

The Premier League have announced that Mark Clattenburg will referee an Everton home game for the first time in 6 years when he takes charge of the match against Southampton on 29th December.
The Tyne-and-Wear official caused outrage at Goodison Park for a trio of controversial decisions in the Merseyside derby of October 2007, a game that Liverpool won 2-1 and which would go down in Everton folklore as "The Clattenburg derby".

In the most notorious of the incidents, Clattenburg appeared to change his mind from awarding Tony Hibbert a yellow card for a "foul" on Steven Gerrard to a straight red card after the Reds' captain had a sly word in the referee's ear.

Dirk Kuyt equalised with the resulting penalty, even though Hibbert's challenge was outside the area, and he would go on to score the winner from the penalty spot in the 89th minute after Phil Neville's deliberately handled on the line.

It was argued that the Dutchman should not have been on the pitch by that point, however, following an outrageous, waist-high two-footed lunge on Neville earlier in the second half that didn't even merit a yellow card in the referee's eyes.

The final insult for Evertonians was Clattenburg's refusal to award a penalty at the other end in injury time when Jamie Carragher visibly hauled Joleon Lescott to the ground as the pair challenged for a corner.

Then manager David Moyes's fury ensured that Clattenburg would not officiate an Everton match until 2012 and has not returned to Goodison until now.

So why can't we stop him officiating any of our games???
This is what some of us have already noted, Norgie. It's what I mean by 'lean Everton's way' in my post above. It's why NC's action seems to be intended simply to keep Clutt away from Saints' games.

Keep up!
[quote][p][bold]Norwegian Saint[/bold] wrote: Well... Well... Well..... check this comment out on an Everton site... The Premier League have announced that Mark Clattenburg will referee an Everton home game for the first time in 6 years when he takes charge of the match against Southampton on 29th December. The Tyne-and-Wear official caused outrage at Goodison Park for a trio of controversial decisions in the Merseyside derby of October 2007, a game that Liverpool won 2-1 and which would go down in Everton folklore as "The Clattenburg derby". In the most notorious of the incidents, Clattenburg appeared to change his mind from awarding Tony Hibbert a yellow card for a "foul" on Steven Gerrard to a straight red card after the Reds' captain had a sly word in the referee's ear. Dirk Kuyt equalised with the resulting penalty, even though Hibbert's challenge was outside the area, and he would go on to score the winner from the penalty spot in the 89th minute after Phil Neville's deliberately handled on the line. It was argued that the Dutchman should not have been on the pitch by that point, however, following an outrageous, waist-high two-footed lunge on Neville earlier in the second half that didn't even merit a yellow card in the referee's eyes. The final insult for Evertonians was Clattenburg's refusal to award a penalty at the other end in injury time when Jamie Carragher visibly hauled Joleon Lescott to the ground as the pair challenged for a corner. Then manager David Moyes's fury ensured that Clattenburg would not officiate an Everton match until 2012 and has not returned to Goodison until now. So why can't we stop him officiating any of our games???[/p][/quote]This is what some of us have already noted, Norgie. It's what I mean by 'lean Everton's way' in my post above. It's why NC's action seems to be intended simply to keep Clutt away from Saints' games. Keep up! Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 2

5:44pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Norwegian Saint says...

From 2009.... Smoke and fire.....????? Personal life and business problems??? £175'000 in debt??? Daily mail not sued over this article??? No apology from the FA???....

Premier League referee Mark Clattenburg, one of English football’s leading officials, has been sacked, Sportsmail can reveal.
The 33-year-old, who had been a Premier League referee since 2004 and was on the FIFA list, is believed to have been dismissed by his bosses at the PGMO, the referees’ governing body, following a secret meeting in London.
Clattenburg — who is expected to appeal — has been sidelined since the start of the season over allegations involving his personal life and business debts. He has denied all the allegations was apparently told by his superiors he would never referee again because of a breach of contract.

Flashpoint: Clattenburg argues a point with Steven Gerrard in the contentious Everton-Liverpool game

More...
EXPOSED: Here's why top ref Mark Clattenburg has been banned
EXCLUSIVE: Banned ref Clattenburg is close to final whistle after secret meeting discussion
Top referee Clattenburg set to be dropped from duty for some time over business failure

Sportsmail first revealed how he was suspended after he was accused of sending an email threatening the family of a business associate. He was dropped from August’ s Community Shield at Wembley just hours after the FA and the PGMO were alerted to the accusation.
An internal investigation was immediately launched into his business dealings and alleged debts of almost £175,000 and then, after receiving an anonymous letter, into his personal life.
Clattenburg denied the allegations and, in an interview with Sportsmail, insisted he would clear his name and return to football.
But at a meeting last Wednesday, officials are said to have informed him that he no longer had a future officiating top-flight football. He is believed to be the first referee in the modern era to be dismissed.
Last night, the Premier League said the ‘disciplinary process’ was ongoing.
But an insider confirmed: ‘He was sacked at a meeting last Wednesday. He has since lodged an appeal against the decision so, as far as the authorities are concerned, the process is still ongoing.’

Sacked: Clattenburg
Clattenburg’s problems began days before the Community Shield when a business associate involved in a legal dispute with the referee, who runs his own electrical firm, tipped off the football authorities after receiving an email he deemed to be threatening.
The email read: ‘Check you can use our companies (sic) money to fund your legal crusade against me. If not, taking me to court might cause your family some pain.’
The recipient forwarded the email to a lawyer with the firm Eversheds on August 7 and within three hours the FA and PGMO had announced the referee’s suspension.
Clattenburg, rated as one of the best young officials in the game, was removed from the Manchester United-Portsmouth fixture on August 10 and, as the inquiry into his affairs continued, a computer he once used for work relating to his electrical business was seized by Eversheds.
When Sportsmail contacted Clattenburg in September, he said: ‘Every allegation that has been put against me, I have proved all the evidence against it. And I’ll do exactly the same again. I’m innocent.’
Clattenburg’s problems have escalated since his controversial performance in Everton’s home match against Liverpool in October last year, when he received death
threats after sending off Tony Hibbert and giving Liverpool a penalty when the defender fouled Steven Gerrard on the edge of the penalty area.
Clattenburg then ignored two penalty appeals against Liverpool captain Jamie Carragher and produced only a yellow card for Dirk Kuyt’s two-footed lunge on Phil Neville as Liverpool won 2-1. Almost 3,000 fans signed an internet petition calling for Clattenburg to be stopped from officiating.
Born in Consett, County Durham, he worked as an electrician before becoming a full-time referee. He made his Football League debut aged just 25 — then a post-war
record — in August 2000.
In 2004 he was promoted to the Select Group and his first match at this level was Everton’s 3-1 win at Crystal Palace. Two years later he made his way on to the FIFA list at the age of 30.
A Premier League spokesman said: ‘The disciplinary procedure is still ongoing; therefore it would be inappropriate for us to offer any further comment at this time.’
Clattenburg refused to comment when contacted last night.

More...
EXPOSED: Here's why top ref Mark Clattenburg has been banned
EXCLUSIVE: Banned ref Clattenburg is close to final whistle after secret meeting discussion
Top referee Clattenburg set to be dropped from duty for some time over business failure


Read more: http://www.dailymail
.co.uk/sport/footbal
l/article-1130055/EX
CLUSIVE-Clattenburg-
sacked-referee-told-
career-breach-contra
ct.html#ixzz2pMH0bV0
0
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
From 2009.... Smoke and fire.....????? Personal life and business problems??? £175'000 in debt??? Daily mail not sued over this article??? No apology from the FA???.... Premier League referee Mark Clattenburg, one of English football’s leading officials, has been sacked, Sportsmail can reveal. The 33-year-old, who had been a Premier League referee since 2004 and was on the FIFA list, is believed to have been dismissed by his bosses at the PGMO, the referees’ governing body, following a secret meeting in London. Clattenburg — who is expected to appeal — has been sidelined since the start of the season over allegations involving his personal life and business debts. He has denied all the allegations was apparently told by his superiors he would never referee again because of a breach of contract. Flashpoint: Clattenburg argues a point with Steven Gerrard in the contentious Everton-Liverpool game More... EXPOSED: Here's why top ref Mark Clattenburg has been banned EXCLUSIVE: Banned ref Clattenburg is close to final whistle after secret meeting discussion Top referee Clattenburg set to be dropped from duty for some time over business failure Sportsmail first revealed how he was suspended after he was accused of sending an email threatening the family of a business associate. He was dropped from August’ s Community Shield at Wembley just hours after the FA and the PGMO were alerted to the accusation. An internal investigation was immediately launched into his business dealings and alleged debts of almost £175,000 and then, after receiving an anonymous letter, into his personal life. Clattenburg denied the allegations and, in an interview with Sportsmail, insisted he would clear his name and return to football. But at a meeting last Wednesday, officials are said to have informed him that he no longer had a future officiating top-flight football. He is believed to be the first referee in the modern era to be dismissed. Last night, the Premier League said the ‘disciplinary process’ was ongoing. But an insider confirmed: ‘He was sacked at a meeting last Wednesday. He has since lodged an appeal against the decision so, as far as the authorities are concerned, the process is still ongoing.’ Sacked: Clattenburg Clattenburg’s problems began days before the Community Shield when a business associate involved in a legal dispute with the referee, who runs his own electrical firm, tipped off the football authorities after receiving an email he deemed to be threatening. The email read: ‘Check you can use our companies (sic) money to fund your legal crusade against me. If not, taking me to court might cause your family some pain.’ The recipient forwarded the email to a lawyer with the firm Eversheds on August 7 and within three hours the FA and PGMO had announced the referee’s suspension. Clattenburg, rated as one of the best young officials in the game, was removed from the Manchester United-Portsmouth fixture on August 10 and, as the inquiry into his affairs continued, a computer he once used for work relating to his electrical business was seized by Eversheds. When Sportsmail contacted Clattenburg in September, he said: ‘Every allegation that has been put against me, I have proved all the evidence against it. And I’ll do exactly the same again. I’m innocent.’ Clattenburg’s problems have escalated since his controversial performance in Everton’s home match against Liverpool in October last year, when he received death threats after sending off Tony Hibbert and giving Liverpool a penalty when the defender fouled Steven Gerrard on the edge of the penalty area. Clattenburg then ignored two penalty appeals against Liverpool captain Jamie Carragher and produced only a yellow card for Dirk Kuyt’s two-footed lunge on Phil Neville as Liverpool won 2-1. Almost 3,000 fans signed an internet petition calling for Clattenburg to be stopped from officiating. Born in Consett, County Durham, he worked as an electrician before becoming a full-time referee. He made his Football League debut aged just 25 — then a post-war record — in August 2000. In 2004 he was promoted to the Select Group and his first match at this level was Everton’s 3-1 win at Crystal Palace. Two years later he made his way on to the FIFA list at the age of 30. A Premier League spokesman said: ‘The disciplinary procedure is still ongoing; therefore it would be inappropriate for us to offer any further comment at this time.’ Clattenburg refused to comment when contacted last night. More... EXPOSED: Here's why top ref Mark Clattenburg has been banned EXCLUSIVE: Banned ref Clattenburg is close to final whistle after secret meeting discussion Top referee Clattenburg set to be dropped from duty for some time over business failure Read more: http://www.dailymail .co.uk/sport/footbal l/article-1130055/EX CLUSIVE-Clattenburg- sacked-referee-told- career-breach-contra ct.html#ixzz2pMH0bV0 0 Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook Norwegian Saint
  • Score: 2

6:12pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Marchwood Malcom says...

Strasbourg Saint wrote:
Marchwood Malcom wrote:
Alicesdad wrote:
Sadoldgitte wrote:
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence.

However I still predict a riot.
I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.
Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-)

Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts.

1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here.

2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him.
I agree with you that neither Spider or the ref behaved properly, and yes the ref should have more sense than to say what he said. My gripe is how what he said can be classed as abusive. And was it really worth pursing? God bless Nicola who is an absolute diamond, but I think he got this one wrong.
And i think you have a strong point about NC trying to "even" things out, but I'd rather the result didn't make us look like a bunch of chip on our shoulder whingers.
I want us to act like we belong at the head table, because we do.
[quote][p][bold]Strasbourg Saint[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Alicesdad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.[/p][/quote]I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence. However I still predict a riot.[/p][/quote]I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.[/p][/quote]Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-) Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts. 1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here. 2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him.[/p][/quote]I agree with you that neither Spider or the ref behaved properly, and yes the ref should have more sense than to say what he said. My gripe is how what he said can be classed as abusive. And was it really worth pursing? God bless Nicola who is an absolute diamond, but I think he got this one wrong. And i think you have a strong point about NC trying to "even" things out, but I'd rather the result didn't make us look like a bunch of chip on our shoulder whingers. I want us to act like we belong at the head table, because we do. Marchwood Malcom
  • Score: 2

6:59pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Velleity says...

I blame Guly
I blame Guly Velleity
  • Score: -1

7:01pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Norwegian Saint says...

Clatterbrain has officiated in 10 matches with Saints.

Won 1
Drawn 5
Lost 4

Last and ONLY win away at Leyton Orient 2-0 League One 9 Apr 2011
Last five games have been away... Lost 3 drawn 2
In those five games at least six highly controversial decisions.
Only officiated two games in 2008/9 season due to "business dealings" running up a debt of £175,000
And (as mentioned before by others) the famous Everton v Liverpool match of 2007 where he never refereed another home Everton game for 6 years... the game against us
Clatterbrain has officiated in 10 matches with Saints. Won 1 Drawn 5 Lost 4 Last and ONLY win away at Leyton Orient 2-0 League One 9 Apr 2011 Last five games have been away... Lost 3 drawn 2 In those five games at least six highly controversial decisions. Only officiated two games in 2008/9 season due to "business dealings" running up a debt of £175,000 And (as mentioned before by others) the famous Everton v Liverpool match of 2007 where he never refereed another home Everton game for 6 years... the game against us Norwegian Saint
  • Score: 2

7:31pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Clever Dick says...

Are there any other current day officials who constantly seem to be in the headlines . As the saying goes there is no smoke without fire. It's time for him to be phased out so that the next "centre of attention" can have his day.
Are there any other current day officials who constantly seem to be in the headlines . As the saying goes there is no smoke without fire. It's time for him to be phased out so that the next "centre of attention" can have his day. Clever Dick
  • Score: 0

7:41pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Alicesdad wrote:
Clattenburg is an idiot, he likes the fame and tries to banter with the players so probably revelled in this. Leave it - he's not worth th effort. Just remember he's just a bloke who runs around in shorts blowing a whistle..just 100 years ago he would have been locked up until after the full moon.

However we should focus on major issues of the day and it is clear that Saints are becoming more and more guilty of abhorrent crimes against minority groups.

How long before Saints are accused of blatant racism? The number of English players we are using is clearly biased and shows how we are institutionally anti Johnny-foreigner. There will of course be those who reply that we have more nationalities in our squad than the average school Atlas... ha! what do they know !! Only recently the crowd was heard singing "Come On England" during a League Match. It even made the England Manager smile ... for heavens sake how much more proof do they need ?

These thing smust be taken seriously or we will lose all sense of perspective.

Have we had a riot yet ?
If Clottenburg turns up to Officiate a game of ours I will personally start a riot, I won't be around when it all kicks off mind, I am not that daft.
[quote][p][bold]Alicesdad[/bold] wrote: Clattenburg is an idiot, he likes the fame and tries to banter with the players so probably revelled in this. Leave it - he's not worth th effort. Just remember he's just a bloke who runs around in shorts blowing a whistle..just 100 years ago he would have been locked up until after the full moon. However we should focus on major issues of the day and it is clear that Saints are becoming more and more guilty of abhorrent crimes against minority groups. How long before Saints are accused of blatant racism? The number of English players we are using is clearly biased and shows how we are institutionally anti Johnny-foreigner. There will of course be those who reply that we have more nationalities in our squad than the average school Atlas... ha! what do they know !! Only recently the crowd was heard singing "Come On England" during a League Match. It even made the England Manager smile ... for heavens sake how much more proof do they need ? These thing smust be taken seriously or we will lose all sense of perspective. Have we had a riot yet ?[/p][/quote]If Clottenburg turns up to Officiate a game of ours I will personally start a riot, I won't be around when it all kicks off mind, I am not that daft. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

7:44pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Velleity wrote:
I blame Guly
Coming soon to a Football pitch near you, the new improved Super Guly, he has been rebuilt, renamed Guly Majors, the Million Dollar (plus VAT) Man..........
[quote][p][bold]Velleity[/bold] wrote: I blame Guly[/p][/quote]Coming soon to a Football pitch near you, the new improved Super Guly, he has been rebuilt, renamed Guly Majors, the Million Dollar (plus VAT) Man.......... OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

7:50pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Marchwood Malcom wrote:
The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads.
They have been struggling to find skeletons in our cupboard, they aren't going to let a chance like this go untapped, it's a godsend for them, whether we are justified or not, that won't matter in their coverage, and they won't let fair play or the truth get in the way either.
[quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads.[/p][/quote]They have been struggling to find skeletons in our cupboard, they aren't going to let a chance like this go untapped, it's a godsend for them, whether we are justified or not, that won't matter in their coverage, and they won't let fair play or the truth get in the way either. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 0

7:57pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Marchwood Malcom wrote:
Strasbourg Saint wrote:
Marchwood Malcom wrote:
Alicesdad wrote:
Sadoldgitte wrote:
Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.
I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence.

However I still predict a riot.
I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.
Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-)

Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts.

1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here.

2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him.
I agree with you that neither Spider or the ref behaved properly, and yes the ref should have more sense than to say what he said. My gripe is how what he said can be classed as abusive. And was it really worth pursing? God bless Nicola who is an absolute diamond, but I think he got this one wrong.
And i think you have a strong point about NC trying to "even" things out, but I'd rather the result didn't make us look like a bunch of chip on our shoulder whingers.
I want us to act like we belong at the head table, because we do.
Spider?
[quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Strasbourg Saint[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Alicesdad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sadoldgitte[/bold] wrote: Hardly abusive or insulting. It just makes the club look stupid and childish now.[/p][/quote]I have to say I agree. If we are going to make a stand against poor refereeing we should go for someoone who has done a serious offence. However I still predict a riot.[/p][/quote]I agree with both of you. IF, that is all he said, how can it be described as "abusive". Yes he's a poor referee who is also quite annoying, but we will come out of this looking like a small little provincial club complaining over any old nonsense. Best this is swept under the carpet toot sweet.[/p][/quote]Toot sweet? You are very different now, since you moved to Marchwood - you never used to misspell basic French! :-) Joking apart, Malcolm, you and Sadoldgitte are missing the point on two fronts. 1. It's not what was said, it's whether it was an appropriate thing for a referee to say (which isn't accurate anyway). As a teacher of English, I have to offer opinions to students ..... about their English grammar etc. What I shouldn't do is suggest that a student's attitude has changed because of some success he or she has had. It's none of my business. Imagine if a 16-year-old female student of mine had recently won a local beauty contest and I thought her effort had dropped as a result of her success. No way would I make a judgement call that the two situations were connected. For all I know there could be other factors or no factors whatsoever. It's about acting professionally and it would seem that Clutt didn't act professionally here. 2. More important for me is the aim of trying to ensure that Clutt doesn't officiate future Saints' games or, if he does, that there is the same pressure on him to 'lean our way' as there must have been for him to 'lean Everton's way' last week. That's NOT about being childish or stupid but about trying to find a way to redress the imbalances that are costing us points. I hate the way Fergie, Wenger and so forth pressurise refs into 'leaning their way', it's bullying and is out of order. However, if NC can find legal and non-bullying ways to 'even things out' (that's to say, use the available structures), then - reluctantly - I'm with him.[/p][/quote]I agree with you that neither Spider or the ref behaved properly, and yes the ref should have more sense than to say what he said. My gripe is how what he said can be classed as abusive. And was it really worth pursing? God bless Nicola who is an absolute diamond, but I think he got this one wrong. And i think you have a strong point about NC trying to "even" things out, but I'd rather the result didn't make us look like a bunch of chip on our shoulder whingers. I want us to act like we belong at the head table, because we do.[/p][/quote]Spider? OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 0

7:58pm Fri 3 Jan 14

el caballo santos101 says...

lets not forget that lalla was booked for arguing with `that ref`, was he booked for being a `big time Charlie` or for changing the way he argues with refs just because he played for England?
people are forgetting that it shouldn't matter that lalla has played or England, why should `that ref` bring it up? he must have the fact that lalla has played for England on his mind during the game to bring it up in an argument.
why is `that ref` concerned that lalla has played for England?
im behind NC all the way on this, there must have been something else said, that the pgmol hasn't released in its statement, for NC to continue with the claim.
why are former officials allowed to rule on the conduct of current officials? surely the refs should have independent assessors and an independent panel to oversee their conduct and officiating.
lets not forget that lalla was booked for arguing with `that ref`, was he booked for being a `big time Charlie` or for changing the way he argues with refs just because he played for England? people are forgetting that it shouldn't matter that lalla has played or England, why should `that ref` bring it up? he must have the fact that lalla has played for England on his mind during the game to bring it up in an argument. why is `that ref` concerned that lalla has played for England? im behind NC all the way on this, there must have been something else said, that the pgmol hasn't released in its statement, for NC to continue with the claim. why are former officials allowed to rule on the conduct of current officials? surely the refs should have independent assessors and an independent panel to oversee their conduct and officiating. el caballo santos101
  • Score: 2

8:08pm Fri 3 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Mr Rodgers on the mat for saying bad things about Officials, he should know better, you can't upset deities and get away with it. Everton boss and Arsenal boss praising Clottenburg, they would, he handed them three points on a plate. Cynical? Moi?
Mr Rodgers on the mat for saying bad things about Officials, he should know better, you can't upset deities and get away with it. Everton boss and Arsenal boss praising Clottenburg, they would, he handed them three points on a plate. Cynical? Moi? OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 2

8:37pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Clever Dick says...

el caballo santos101 wrote:
lets not forget that lalla was booked for arguing with `that ref`, was he booked for being a `big time Charlie` or for changing the way he argues with refs just because he played for England?
people are forgetting that it shouldn't matter that lalla has played or England, why should `that ref` bring it up? he must have the fact that lalla has played for England on his mind during the game to bring it up in an argument.
why is `that ref` concerned that lalla has played for England?
im behind NC all the way on this, there must have been something else said, that the pgmol hasn't released in its statement, for NC to continue with the claim.
why are former officials allowed to rule on the conduct of current officials? surely the refs should have independent assessors and an independent panel to oversee their conduct and officiating.
Adam had every right to claim a penalty on that occasion. Whether he plays for England or not there isn't a player in the world who would have done any different. Every Saints player on screen put their hand in the air the instant it happened. The reason they all did this ,as we all know, is that it was clearly a nailed on penalty. Clutter brain was close at hand and his view was clear. Therefore he is either bent or blind. Either way he should not be refereeing andthe powers that be should not be protecting him.
[quote][p][bold]el caballo santos101[/bold] wrote: lets not forget that lalla was booked for arguing with `that ref`, was he booked for being a `big time Charlie` or for changing the way he argues with refs just because he played for England? people are forgetting that it shouldn't matter that lalla has played or England, why should `that ref` bring it up? he must have the fact that lalla has played for England on his mind during the game to bring it up in an argument. why is `that ref` concerned that lalla has played for England? im behind NC all the way on this, there must have been something else said, that the pgmol hasn't released in its statement, for NC to continue with the claim. why are former officials allowed to rule on the conduct of current officials? surely the refs should have independent assessors and an independent panel to oversee their conduct and officiating.[/p][/quote]Adam had every right to claim a penalty on that occasion. Whether he plays for England or not there isn't a player in the world who would have done any different. Every Saints player on screen put their hand in the air the instant it happened. The reason they all did this ,as we all know, is that it was clearly a nailed on penalty. Clutter brain was close at hand and his view was clear. Therefore he is either bent or blind. Either way he should not be refereeing andthe powers that be should not be protecting him. Clever Dick
  • Score: 1

8:42pm Fri 3 Jan 14

JohnItaly says...

A bad day for Saints has just got worse - Lawro has predicted a Saint's victory tomorrow.
A bad day for Saints has just got worse - Lawro has predicted a Saint's victory tomorrow. JohnItaly
  • Score: 0

9:37pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Clever Dick says...

That's outrageous! I think Nicola should complain to the BBC about this.
That's outrageous! I think Nicola should complain to the BBC about this. Clever Dick
  • Score: 0

6:24am Sat 4 Jan 14

Marchwood Malcom says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
Marchwood Malcom wrote:
The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads.
They have been struggling to find skeletons in our cupboard, they aren't going to let a chance like this go untapped, it's a godsend for them, whether we are justified or not, that won't matter in their coverage, and they won't let fair play or the truth get in the way either.
Why have they been trying to find skeletons in our cupboard? SFC is a friendly, likeable club. We haven't exactly trod on anyone's toes. We're not a South Coast version of the 80s Wimbledon. We play nice football and have players who do the club proud, both on and off the pitch. And we are one of the few top flight clubs fielding young English talent. Why anyone would want have a go at us is beyond me, unless they are of the Skate persuasion.
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Marchwood Malcom[/bold] wrote: The club are getting slaughtered on national newspaper threads.[/p][/quote]They have been struggling to find skeletons in our cupboard, they aren't going to let a chance like this go untapped, it's a godsend for them, whether we are justified or not, that won't matter in their coverage, and they won't let fair play or the truth get in the way either.[/p][/quote]Why have they been trying to find skeletons in our cupboard? SFC is a friendly, likeable club. We haven't exactly trod on anyone's toes. We're not a South Coast version of the 80s Wimbledon. We play nice football and have players who do the club proud, both on and off the pitch. And we are one of the few top flight clubs fielding young English talent. Why anyone would want have a go at us is beyond me, unless they are of the Skate persuasion. Marchwood Malcom
  • Score: 1

5:51pm Sat 4 Jan 14

twistnshout says...

I can see nothing wrong with Clattenburgs comment, sureley better for refs and players to talk than be confrontational. Yes Llalane has changed since his England cap, he is playing better and diving less.
I can see nothing wrong with Clattenburgs comment, sureley better for refs and players to talk than be confrontational. Yes Llalane has changed since his England cap, he is playing better and diving less. twistnshout
  • Score: -1

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