New junction is ‘death waiting to happen’

This is how the junction was meant to look according to the initial plans

This is how the junction was meant to look according to the initial plans

First published in Readers' Letters

THE recently completed junction that replaced the roundabout where the Itchen Bridge meets Central Bridge, Saltmarsh Road and Albert Road North seemed like a good, well thought out design, though it wasn’t originally anything close to a Dutch-style layout like they touted.

I do remember it would have been a vast improvement to that junction, as I remember when the plans were first revealed that there would be seperate cycle lights to allow cyclists at the originally planned advanced stop lines (ASLs) to cross the junction/ make turns ahead of motorised traffic, and then wide, shared paths going from one end of the Itchen Bridge to the other, on both sides of the road, which would have been a semi-Dutch design.

What we have ended up with instead is death waiting to happen, not only on the junction itself but also at the silly little bus bypasses at two of the three bus stops around the junction which are barely a fifth of the size used on London’s Cycle Super Highways, some of which are far closer to Dutch designs than SCC’s attempt. The junction that our council has installed, is actually an American design that is dangerous, there are also no ASLs at any of the lights which is dangerous when motorists are allowed to turn left, as this often results in cyclists being overtaken by a left-turning vehicle.

Cycle lanes going up the inside of traffic exacerbates the problem further, especially with large vehicles.

A true Dutch-style junction would have seen cycle paths put in with cycle crossings that have lights prioritised for cyclists so there is minimal delay for them and to make it safe for them to cross the junction – that would have been a truly Dutch-style junction.

I will be using this junction as often as possible over the next few months to keep an eye on the situation and will be sure to document anything and everything that happens using my helmet camera and rear-facing bike camera.

I personally will not be using the silly green paint or bus bypasses on or around the junction though, as it is probably more dangerous than the roundabout it replaced.

Southampton City Council, please, send someone to Amsterdam to have a real look at the Dutch designs and then dramatically change this junction to match what that person sees in Amsterdam.

Michael Andrews, from Thornhill, Southampton

Comments (8)

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1:00pm Wed 26 Feb 14

bigfella777 says...

Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving. bigfella777
  • Score: 7

1:31pm Wed 26 Feb 14

Inform Al says...

bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
When I was a keen cyclist I had no problem with right angle turns, it just meant going slow. I like the idea of traffic cameras, perhaps cyclists should be made to show number plates to assist.
[quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]When I was a keen cyclist I had no problem with right angle turns, it just meant going slow. I like the idea of traffic cameras, perhaps cyclists should be made to show number plates to assist. Inform Al
  • Score: -3

1:51pm Wed 26 Feb 14

Zexagon says...

bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?
[quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted? Zexagon
  • Score: -5

3:56pm Wed 26 Feb 14

bigfella777 says...

Zexagon wrote:
bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?
Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.
[quote][p][bold]Zexagon[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?[/p][/quote]Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before. bigfella777
  • Score: 8

4:31pm Wed 26 Feb 14

camerajuan says...

bigfella777 wrote:
Zexagon wrote:
bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?
Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.
If another one cuts me up because they can't wait at a junction again you might read about it soon.
[quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Zexagon[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?[/p][/quote]Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.[/p][/quote]If another one cuts me up because they can't wait at a junction again you might read about it soon. camerajuan
  • Score: 3

6:46pm Wed 26 Feb 14

loosehead says...

still feel getting a Euro Grant & build a new cycle/footpath across would have been better
still feel getting a Euro Grant & build a new cycle/footpath across would have been better loosehead
  • Score: 5

3:25am Sat 1 Mar 14

Mary80 says...

bigfella777 wrote:
Zexagon wrote:
bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?
Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.
A large percent still go thru red lights see several a day do this suicidal action
[quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Zexagon[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?[/p][/quote]Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.[/p][/quote]A large percent still go thru red lights see several a day do this suicidal action Mary80
  • Score: -1

11:33am Sat 1 Mar 14

Ginger_cyclist says...

Mary80 wrote:
bigfella777 wrote:
Zexagon wrote:
bigfella777 wrote:
Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't.
As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality?
I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game.
It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.
We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?
Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.
A large percent still go thru red lights see several a day do this suicidal action
Still a minority considering it's a few out of 10's of thousands in Southampton alone, seen more motorists jump the lights before, including those who are supposed to be professionals, like the bus driver that got a severe talking to from the manager at first because they not only stopped in the ASL by the bargate bus stops while the lights were red but they also kept creeping forwards while the lights were red until they decided to jump the light completely, by which time, another bus was on it's way round and had to stop, the traffic lights were't broken either as when the other bus cme through the lights, the ones that got jumped went green.
[quote][p][bold]Mary80[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Zexagon[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bigfella777[/bold] wrote: Or Copenhagen, or Malmo or Berlin or Krakow. In fact most Euro cities seem to get it right where we can't. As has been proved today this junction is dangerous, only one week before the first accident, how long until the first fatality? I've tried it , I didn't feel safe, how do you make right angle turns? This is real life not a video game. It needs heavy CCTV so the car drivers can be prosecuted for dangerous driving.[/p][/quote]We'll said, and it'll catch cyclists riding like tw4ts. Oh wait how will they be prosecuted?[/p][/quote]Whatever, idiot, I've never seen a cyclist kill a car driver before.[/p][/quote]A large percent still go thru red lights see several a day do this suicidal action[/p][/quote]Still a minority considering it's a few out of 10's of thousands in Southampton alone, seen more motorists jump the lights before, including those who are supposed to be professionals, like the bus driver that got a severe talking to from the manager at first because they not only stopped in the ASL by the bargate bus stops while the lights were red but they also kept creeping forwards while the lights were red until they decided to jump the light completely, by which time, another bus was on it's way round and had to stop, the traffic lights were't broken either as when the other bus cme through the lights, the ones that got jumped went green. Ginger_cyclist
  • Score: 0

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